[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/rugby-world-cup/11893385/England-vs-Wales-Huge-Sam-Burgess-gamble-played-to-Wales-strengths-at-Twickenham.htmlA whole article from the Telegraph as to why it was the selection of Sam Burgess that was England's downfall[/url

What are you going on about? I wasn't wrong because i know what i thought the OP was talking about and a few of us have actually tried to say that the OP has actually got it wrong as to say that our international game suffers because of who plays for whom and where they're really from. There are far greater problems than that. A few of us have tried to ignore the inane ramblings about Union and tried to concentrate on our sport. My point about "why are so many posts about Union in this thread" were aimed at posters just using this as a RUWC comments thread. It wasn't about you, the only time i mentioned you was in telling Him to ignore you as you cannot tell the difference between "we cannot copy what Union do" and "we could learn from what they do" which are two different things and you tried to tell Him who made the point and i fully understood, that they are the same thing.

Jesus, talk about trying to pick an argument over nothing. And grow up will you; "man enough to admit you're wrong"; we're adults here trying to have grown up conversations.

The International Game, as applicable to Rugby League, is now a joke. It has no relevance to the major teams (my club , my club, ad infinitum), and offers little or no help to develop , promote or foster the game.

RL HAD a lead but just didn't have the gonads or vision to take it to the next level.

If it want's to meaningful, regular COMPETITIVE international games again it will not be a short term solution but will take generations even if started now, which is unlikely under the current regimes.

You're a ray of sunshine aren't you.

1.They don't have a 3rd tier record in England. They have a 2nd tier one but as I said, put together on less than their elite side. Their elite side was better than their Championship side.
2.no you made a flawed argument highlighting their Championship performances as reflective of their elite quality.
3. So it doesn't cover Catalonia. Odd choice.
4. And that makes it a misleading overstatement. Which is pointless. There is no benefit to us overstating the problem and no use in us understating it. The game is strong in the north of englanf and south of France. Everywhere else it struggles and has no plan to overcome those struggles or a system where that can be done.

YES!!!

I think this article from ex Ireland centre Gordon D'arcy is pretty much aimed at blaming Burgess!! [urlhttp://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/gordon-d-arcy-burgess-is-blunder-that-could-bury-england-1.2371821[/url

Actually it's not blaming him at all...it's blaming the speed at which he was promoted to the International side.

Like it or not, playing 12 or 13 in Union is about timing in defense and attack with strong "pairings" being key to success. The AB's Smith and Nonu have well over 50 tests together as did D'arcy and O'Driscoll....picking Burgess there was an error. Not his though.

Sam Burgess an outstanding athlete and Rugby player, but in League he ran straight at people and they ran straight at him......as boring as it may be, Union isn't about that and it was wrong of Lancaster to pick him IMHO.

As I said, most of the England team have got it in the neck including Burgess, what Juan Cornetto was claiming was it's because the pundits are 'anti-league', unless you are saying that ex-RL players are above criticism then SB will face get criticism as others have done. Both Gordon D'arcy and Brian O'driscoll have said SB is not ready, do you think both of them are anti-league even though they both hail from Ireland? RL just isn't that important enough (especially in Ireland) for them to have a grudge against it. GD explains that it took him 3 years before he understood all the nuances of playing in the centres at test-match level, which explains why he thinks Burgess isn't upto speed yet. Bearing in mind between them D'arcy and O'driscoll have 224 international test caps for Ireland and The Lions playing in the centres, and have won 6 European Cups between them, I (and anybody else who watches RU) would take their opinions about SB playing in the centres over yours and Juan Cornettos any day of the week.

Irishmen have no reason to talk up one of their main rivals.

Another man of the match level of performance by Hardaker for Leeds v Saints this Friday will, I reckon, make it almost impossible for McNamara not to give him the England no 1 shirt.