It appears to be one of those Dual Reg agreements where absolutely no players end up playing for the "child" club. The only thing the Bulls have had from them on the playing front is Jake Butler-Fleming and that was a loan, not DR.

I still prefer that to clubs like Swinton and Sheffield though who appear to be told which Wigan/Saints players are playing for them this week and their own players have to make way (total speculation by the way...)

I don’t think Kirk is of the quality yet for this kind of opposition, especially on hot day. He’s willing enough but he’s a bit ponderous. He seems to go to ground easily rather than keeping the legs driving and in defence his feet seem to stay planted. In his last year in the 19s he was dominating the opposition but it’s a different matter against grown men. If he’s going to make it I think he’ll be one that comes good later in his career I reckon. Yesterday the more experienced props stood out for us. Kirk and Bustin looked a bit out of their depth. Their times will come.

Just this ^.

I know it's wishful thinking and all academic but imagine the difference if Sidlow had been popped on a plane...we needed brawn and experience in those first 20 mins.

Thought York had blown it when they started off at 100 mph in that heat. It was obvious they couldn't sustain that pace for the eighty and so it proved, but with our mistakes with the ball and rank poor tackling in the threequarters, they, just about, got the advantage they needed in that opening 30 minutes. They were blowing out of their backsides late on though and we should have made them pay to be honest, but we were never steady enough and lacked imagination at times, especially after Keyes went off.

Coulda, shoulda, woulda - but didn't. Congrats to York who took the spoils on the day. It's still all to play for.

Far too many times especially in the first half, they were starting sets near their own line and getting past half way by the 5th tackle with ease

In terms of our halfbacks I've said it before. Chisolm and Keyes don't play well together, there's a marked difference in how we organise when either is off the field.

Both good players in their own rights but they don't seem to have gelled at all. Just my two penneth.

The slow starts are a concern as has been noticed, but is anyone else also concerned about our lack of “big game mentality”? In recent years we seem to have gone to pot in almost every single game that is labelled of some importance. OK, we beat York at the start of the year when both sides were more ring rusty, but when it’s come down to the business end of the season and promotion is practically on a plate, it’s like the players didn’t seem aware of the stakes until half time. It seems this has been a pattern in a few end of year games. We were chasing the game in huge end of the season clashes against Leigh at home in 2015, (almost a carbon copy of yesterday’s game except with the conversion going the wrong way), the MPG vs Wakefield and the less said about Fev in 2016 the better. And no, I don’t count the Championship Shield

The only major game I can remember us winning in the past few years that meant something was Leigh away to get to the Million Pound Game. Don’t get me wrong, this isn’t an “the end is nigh” type post, but it is a concern given that after yesterday, we are slightly less likely to go up automatically. If we have to do it via the playoffs, then that’ll be two big games in a row – we have the squad, sure, but the mentality could be cause for concern. I’d have said I trust Kear to get that right given his record, but yesterday was an all too familiar hint of our recent past.

The lack of a natural leader on the field yesterday showed. Its only when George came on and started shouting at them we looked more cohesive. York wanted it more than us, and despite the build up I never felt it was a massive game; we're still in the driving seat, although neither of us can afford to drop points now admittedly.

That initial 20 minutes was keystone cops bad, but we had them on the ropes at the end, and had the game lasted another 5 minutes (5 minutes that the York players wasted though feigning injury and gamesmanship in doing things) we would have beaten them.

I though Chizzy was better when Keys left, but often it takes a big blow for a team to pull together. Having said that the York try from Chizzys kick to Ethan was really bad game management. Why not go for a grubber through and have another 5? Everyone knows Ethans game and plugging it every 5th on the oppositions 20 is getting stale. I hope we can learn from it.

However, if we had won I could see complacency sneaking in the last few games. At least now after this result, it won't happen. [sizeI hope.[/size

On the issue of big match temperament the side has changed a fair bit since the Leigh game and the Fev fiasco. However we did look taken by surprise by the way York came out of the traps. Maybe we were a bit complacent. The point about us improving when Flanagan came on is a good point. When he came on we started to take control back around the ruck. He also got under the skin of a few in the York side who were having a big say for them up to that point.

On Keyes and Chisholm playing together I’m not sure it’s the combination that’s the issue. Often the pass from dummy half is so off target it forces them to have to re-adjust which then gives the defence time to get in our faces. It was certainly the case yesterday. If the pass off the ground is poor it often causes the whole move to be poor. York made sure they did all they could to make that happen, it was an area where we were out-thought.

The other impact that Keyes coming off caused was it used a substitution up which meant we couldn’t get George on for the last 10 minutes

I wondered why he didn't re-appear, that explains it thanks. It does make me wonder why Bustin came back on when he looked so out of sorts in the heat.

As Bullseye said the team has changed a lot since the Leigh and Fev fiascos but it doesn't seem to matter, new players, new coach, new division but we still don't turn up when it matters. There is nothing surer now than we can't simply rely on getting results but we also have to play to our potential and run in some points.

Not sure I accept this notion about 'failing' in big games. Big games are games against the 'better sides', you don't need to be Einstein to work out that you are more likely to be troubled by the 'better sides' than by lower placed teams. We beat York on their own midden in the first game of the season and we virtually knocked Donny, who IIRC would have taken over as league leaders if they'd won, out of the title race at their place. Wigan and Saints lose more games against the 'better sides' too..