FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!
  
FORUMS > Bradford Bulls > Potter CANNOT get a new deal!
75 posts in 6 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin
RankPostsTeam
International Star884No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Nov 201014 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Dec 2017Jun 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature

:



Don't think you need to go into conspiracy theories to show how some clubs can spend more money than others.

Prize money doesn't count on the cap so if you have a club that can expect to be successful and a player willing to take a risk on exactly how much prize money is in the pot then you have them paid x from from the cap and a percentage of any prize money each year.

Clubs with wealthy backers don't need the prize money for club costs as the backer covers these freeing up the prize money as player bonuses.

The cap may be the same for everyone but the actual funds available to pay players isn't and comes down to SL position and how far you get in the cup each season.

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman14145No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Aug 2020Oct 2019LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
45_1302643626.jpg
:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_45.jpg



If you believe that prize money is the only differentiating factor, and can account for all the difference, that is up to you.

If you believe that clubs do not anyway pass on prize money to players, wealthy owner or not, that is up to you.

If you believe that, for example, Harris was paid every penny of his (substantial) package by the club, rather than by unconnected* third party Publico, that is up to you.

If you believe that other marquee players across the game do not receive image rights payments from third parties - or, if they DO, that it does not affect their playing package - that is up to you.

And that is just looking at the perfectly legal matter of third party-paid image rights.



* Until the RFL decided they WERE connected, hence the retrospective cap breach.

RankPostsTeam
International Star884No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Nov 201014 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Dec 2017Jun 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature

:



People are asking how can we have such a gulf in the quality of the two teams if we are spending the same salary cap. What I am saying is, that without stepping outside the rules and bringing "third party" payments or brown envelopes into it, the cap isn't equal anyway.

A team consistantly in the the top 4 and getting to semifinals in the cup has more bargaining power than us.

I didn't say the rest of it wasn't happening and yes funnily enough it is up to me what I think but thanks for reminding me! c020.gif

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach15521
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 201015 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2020May 2020LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
50722_1319672516.jpg
:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_50722.jpg



Quote: Adeybull "And you think it actually NEEDS a lot of players? Think again!

If - hypothetically - a club had on its books a couple of overseas marquee players who, say, could demand a net take-home income of £250k p.a (that is about AUD 370k), if a club paid them what it took to achieve that in pure salary (or cars or houses or whatever) those two players alone would use up £970k of the salary cap! £485k needed to get £250k net, from a back-of envelope calculation.

If, just say, both of those players' agents cut an image rights deal of £160k each, payable to their offshore personal service company, those payments could be made gross. Furtehrmore, since they were non-doms, they would not be liable to UK tax unless they received income fropm their companies AND it was remitted to the UK. The business paying for the image rights might even be totally unconnected with the club's owner, and not doing it as a "you scratch my back I'll scratch yours" job (you never know) and may even get good value for money out of it (I was told, for example, that Harris used to do promotional work for Publico two nights a week, but it was only what I was told).

Now, to get the players up to £250k net, the club NOW only has to pay a salary of £150k each.

Yes, that's right.

So the two mega-marquee players now cost only £300k in terms of the salary cap.

That frees up a massive £670k of salary cap!!!

Which sort of goes a long way towards paying all the OTHER players quite a lot more than could otherwise be the case. And you still get two marquee players.

Ok, the above is simplistic, and it assumes the player can keep the offshore funds free from Aus Tax when he gets home (Singapore Sling, anyone...?) but I hope it serves to demonstrate why this is potentially far, far from just an issue on the periphery.

Like I said, you wouldn't HAVE to do it with every player; just a handful who can legitimately claim to have an image worth decent money.'"


I'm on record as being in complete agreement with you on this one Adey - I seem to recall you putting me on your Christmas card list after a discussion about it on the VT last season, although you've probably since removed me following my frothing about Odsalgate. icon_wink.gif

I would be absolutely flabbergasted if the clubs with wealthy owners aren't using the same wheezes that people of that ilk have always used to stay several steps ahead of HMRC and by extension, light years ahead of whatever system the RFL uses to monitor the so-called 'salary cap.' It's as plain as day that some clubs are fielding squads of significantly higher monetary value than others whilst both would claim to be spending the cap; the difference is that the clubs with wealthy businesses backing them have all the connections, expertise and mechanisms already in place to get money into some of their players bank accounts by means other than a straightforward salary payment and furthermore, to maximise the proportion of the money that said players were able to keep hold of, by using tax-efficiency schemes.

It can sound a bit sour-grapey to moan about the clubs with wealthy sugar-daddies, or rather the lack of same at your own club, but I'm with you on this one; the current situation creates a two-tier SL in ways that goes far beyond the obvious and that in turn fuels the arrogant nonsense that some people spout about reducing to the league to 10 and casting adrift the clubs that can't compete.

Having said all that - would I like our very own Mr Burns, a la Shuddersfield? You bet I would.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach325No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200717 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2014Apr 2014LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
34225.gif
:34225.gif



Quote: Bulls4Champs "I think he has so far. The job is just beyond him, there's only one man for this job and he goes by the name of Brian.'"
in australia at the moment job hunting

RankPostsTeam
Moderator31955
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2024Nov 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
438_1551258406.jpg
"If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them," - Wayne Bennett.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_438.jpg

Moderator


On the issue of Potter I agree with Bullinenemyland that in order to turn things around we need a completely new broom. A new coach with fresh new ideas would be ideal. It happened in 1977 when we brought in Peter Fox and it happened again in 1995/6 with Smith and Elliott. Both had fresh ideas and could get great performances out of limited players and spot potential in the transfer market.

In 1996 we had the help of a pile of cash with the first sky deal. I'm not sure how we're fixed financially after the Odsal deal but if we can possibly do so we need to think about a big shake up.

RankPostsTeam
International Star319No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 201014 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jan 2019Mar 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
51435_1276261580.png
Resistance is futile.:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_51435.png



Quote: Bullseye "On the issue of Potter I agree with Bullinenemyland that in order to turn things around we need a completely new broom. A new coach with fresh new ideas would be ideal. It happened in 1977 when we brought in Peter Fox and it happened again in 1995/6 with Smith and Elliott. Both had fresh ideas and could get great performances out of limited players and spot potential in the transfer market.

In 1996 we had the help of a pile of cash with the first sky deal. I'm not sure how we're fixed financially after the Odsal deal but if we can possibly do so we need to think about a big shake up.'"


I thought that's what Plopper was supposed to be? To be fair, I agree with you and when the big 'who should replace Macca' debate was going on I said as such.

However... I think we have to give Potter the rest of the season. The players who were brought in last were in the main part those who were available where as this season he's had more choice and options. These need to be given time to gel. Several of the Aussies seemed to be 'late' arrivals for various reasons and the pre-season in UK RL is a joke - the only team who seemed to have a proper test (rather than games against other SL teams or those from the lower division) was Wire. The more settled teams are going to hit the ground running compared to those who have once again had a big player turnover. Is Potter good enough? I'm not sure - Saints were hardly a 'bad' team when he took over and weren't Catalans essentially an Aussie team?

I don't think Nobby is the right man for the job. Good as his record was, it was done with a well established squad that he knew inside out.

af
RankPostsTeam
International Chairman10445No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2022Aug 2013LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
731.jpg
Bradford gave us Hockney, Leeds gave us Moyles.:731.jpg



Quote: Bullseye "On the issue of Potter I agree with Bullinenemyland that in order to turn things around we need a completely new broom. A new coach with fresh new ideas would be ideal. It happened in 1977 when we brought in Peter Fox and it happened again in 1995/6 with Smith and Elliott. Both had fresh ideas and could get great performances out of limited players and spot potential in the transfer market.

In 1996 we had the help of a pile of cash with the first sky deal. I'm not sure how we're fixed financially after the Odsal deal but if we can possibly do so we need to think about a big shake up.'"

Was thinking of not so much 96 reprised as 91... A second coming...

RankPostsTeam
Moderator8103
JoinedServiceReputation
Jan 200223 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2024Nov 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
869_1597404840.jpg
//www.twitter.com/pumpetypump:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_869.jpg

Moderator


I think Mick shouldn't get an extension but from a slightly different perspective. In my opinion he should walk voluntarily because this club will have a toxic affect on his ability to find a decent coaching spot in the future.

I don't think the fact that we are utter gash is his fault. Its a gypsy curse or a cabal of feckless players or something else, but Mr Potter should get out now whilst he can still hope to have a career.

75 posts in 6 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin
75 posts in 6 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


3.7177734375:5
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
6m
Shopping list for 2025
Marcus's Bic
5575
15m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Chris71
4016
15m
Film game
karetaker
5635
38m
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
homerjsimpso
14
Recent
2024
Butcher
5
Recent
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
tad rhino
2593
Recent
Leeds away first up
Butcher
41
Recent
Dons Squad 2025
Jemmo
13
Recent
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
195
Recent
Castleford sack Lingard
FIL
8
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
45s
TV Games - Not Hull
UllFC
3080
45s
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
48s
War of the Roses
ratticusfinc
30
48s
2024
Butcher
5
52s
How many games will we win
Butcher
5
1m
Film game
karetaker
5635
1m
Pre Season - 2025
mwindass
183
1m
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
homerjsimpso
14
1m
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
195
1m
Dual Reg
Spookisback
9
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
2024
Butcher
5
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
Butcher
5
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
TODAY
Catalan Away
jonh
5
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
rubber ducki
12
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
Butcher
41
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Butcher
20
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
TODAY
England 5 - 0 Ireland
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To Newcastle
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
418
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
528
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1269
England's Women Demolish The W..
1093
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1332
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1127
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1387
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1926
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2145
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2382
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1957
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2194
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2658
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2089
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2162
POSTSONLINEREGISTRATIONSRECORD
19.65M +12,327 ↑13480,15514,103
LOGIN HERE
or REGISTER for more features!.

When you register you get access to the live match scores, live match chat and you can post in the discussions on the forums.
RLFANS Match Centre
 Thu 13th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Fri 14th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Hull KR
v
Castleford
20:00
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sat 15th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
St.Helens
v
Salford
 Sun 16th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Warrington
 Thu 20th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Wakefield
v
Hull KR
 Fri 21st Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Warrington
v
Catalans
20:00
Hull FC
v
Wigan
 Sat 22nd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
15:00
Salford
v
Leeds
20:00
Castleford
v
St.Helens
 Sun 23rd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
14:30
Leigh
v
Huddersfield
 Thu 6th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
20:00
Hull FC
v
Leigh
 Fri 7th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
20:00
Castleford
v
Salford
20:00
St.Helens
v
Hull KR
 Sat 8th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
17:30
Catalans
v
Leeds
 Sun 9th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R3
17:30
Warrington
v
Wakefield
17:30
Wigan
v
Huddersfield
 Thu 20th Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
20:00
Salford
v
Huddersfield
 Fri 21st Mar 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R4
20:00
St.Helens
v
Warrington
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull KR
Sat 8th Mar
SL
17:30
Catalans-Leeds
Sun 9th Mar
SL
17:30
Warrington-Wakefield
SL
17:30
Wigan-Huddersfield
Thu 20th Mar
SL
20:00
Salford-Huddersfield
Fri 21st Mar
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
6m
Shopping list for 2025
Marcus's Bic
5575
15m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Chris71
4016
15m
Film game
karetaker
5635
38m
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
homerjsimpso
14
Recent
2024
Butcher
5
Recent
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
tad rhino
2593
Recent
Leeds away first up
Butcher
41
Recent
Dons Squad 2025
Jemmo
13
Recent
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
195
Recent
Castleford sack Lingard
FIL
8
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
45s
TV Games - Not Hull
UllFC
3080
45s
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
48s
War of the Roses
ratticusfinc
30
48s
2024
Butcher
5
52s
How many games will we win
Butcher
5
1m
Film game
karetaker
5635
1m
Pre Season - 2025
mwindass
183
1m
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
homerjsimpso
14
1m
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
195
1m
Dual Reg
Spookisback
9
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
2024
Butcher
5
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
Butcher
5
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
TODAY
Catalan Away
jonh
5
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
rubber ducki
12
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
Butcher
41
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
exiledrhino
30
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Butcher
20
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
TODAY
England 5 - 0 Ireland
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To Newcastle
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
418
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
528
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1269
England's Women Demolish The W..
1093
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1332
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1127
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1387
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1926
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2145
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2382
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1957
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2194
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2658
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2089
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2162


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!