Thats alright then. The initial impact is very much shoulder to shoulder.

A direct shoulder>head impact would have seen the head moving away from the shoulder. Instead there was a whiplash type effect where O'briens head moves towards Scrutons shoulder.

Unfortunately, it is not only the initial impact that is looked at. If they decide contact with the head is made it doesn't really matter if the initial contact was elsewhere.

He's tweeted that he is going to fight his case. No early plea. His disciplinary record is good (mitigating) - hopefully not needed.

The disturbing thing about shoulder charges over the last 3 rounds is that they have all been subject to trial by media. Stevo, Eddie & Phil have all judged the severity of each tackle first and pronounced the verdict to the tv audience.

Conspiracy theorists might argue that this is all part of trying to introduce a ban on shoulder charges in SL, to mimic the NRL, without the RFL having to lose face and admit they are playing poodle to the NRL?

If they were right, then you might expect the disciplinary to be totally un-moved by any plea in mitigation.

The mute point here is whether the RFL disciplinary will decide that the officials and the video referee were all right on the day or they were all wrong.

That's a good point.

If the beak decides Scrutes is guilty, its a kick in the nuts for Mr Ganson And Mr Silverwood, as well as the touchies.

Ho hum.

For me, the clincher was that we did not see half the Cas pack pile in to bray hell out of Scrutes. Indeed, we saw no hint of the usual (and understandable) response when one of your mates has just been decked unreasonably. Deacs used to get clattered like that regularly during games. We never saw a procession of big opposition fellas beating a trail to Rot Hall the following Tuesday then, and nor IMO should we on this occasion. It was NOT a deliberate off-the-ball clattering. Had it been, we could have had no complaints.

But if minds are already made up...?

The NRL ruling I reckon will be rescinded, the ruling reworked or the Refs modify the way they look at it, there were two incidents in the NRL All Stars match, Inglis wasn't pinged cause he was static and Rose was cause he was moving! It will be interesting to see if the NRL Refs heed the call to speed up the PTB by various Coachs! One noticable positive during that match and I hope it continues was the lack of referral to the Video Ref! So we shall see if having an ex Coach in charge of the Refs has the good outcome everyone wants. I hope so as it could mean bye bye Cummings! Well Maybe not!! www.nrl.com/rlif-bans-shoulder-c ... fault.aspx Union will be the only real contact sport left (won't inc NFL to much padding!)

The NRL ruling I reckon will be rescinded, the ruling reworked or the Refs modify the way they look at it, there were two incidents in the NRL All Stars match, Inglis wasn't pinged cause he was static and Rose was cause he was moving! It will be interesting to see if the NRL Refs heed the call to speed up the PTB by various Coachs! One noticable positive during that match and I hope it continues was the lack of referral to the Video Ref! So we shall see if having an ex Coach in charge of the Refs has the good outcome everyone wants. I hope so as it could mean bye bye Cummings! Well Maybe not!! www.nrl.com/rlif-bans-shoulder-c ... fault.aspx Union will be the only real contact sport left (won't inc NFL to much padding!)

It was. Called by John Kear on first replay, backed up by Clarke, then the 2 muppets.

The movement of the head is from O'Brien towards Scruton, so Scruton hit shoulder to shoulder and then O'Brien tries to head butt his shoulder.

A bit like the disciplinary panel ignoring the ruling of Tim Roby who was stood 3 yards and lookng directly at the Chase on Hardaker tackle and ruled a knock on.



Again, a bit like the Leeds pack who didn't "pile in" when Chase hit Hardaker. Surely the reaction of the players on the field as well as the match officials who've seen it live should lend weight to what the "punishment" should be?

Hmm if the shoulder charge is banned does that mean if Billy Slater tries to stop Ryan Hall the way he did at Wembley (when he broke his collarbone) then her would get charged now a days?

The Leeds players did go straight to chase,nobody went to Scruton

I agree with this. It does seem that if SKY show the incident enough times then the review panel ban them. I'm fairly confident that if we won't on tele on Saturday, Scruton wouldn't be banned. I watched SL full time for first time last night and one of the worst challenges I saw from the weekend was Meli clearing out Holdsworth during Hulls first try. Yet he wasn't even called up!?

Having had another look I think that the initial contact was shoulder to shoulder and then O'Brien's head hit Scruton's shoulder as opposed to Scruton's shoulder hitting the head (if that makes any sense!).