| FORUMS > St. Helens > Unacceptable |
 |
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16170 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Saint Simon "a perfect example of stats not telling the whole story'"
Go one then. Expand ... |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16963 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2009 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2017 | Oct 2017 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: SaintsFan "Jeez, you really have it in for Makinson don't you?
Here are some stats for you. They're only stats, obviously, but they are the only facts we have to hand.
Stats for Lomax in the Warrington game
Stats don't always tell the whole story. Makinsons stats look as good a lomax in most departments but its where you make the breaks etc that can be match winners.
The two assists by lomax could be worth 12 points on the board which could make the difference in a game.
Even tackling stats can be misleading. Lomax made 2/3 try saving tackles in that game, add that to the two assists and he's man of the match.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16170 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: St pete "Stats don't always tell the whole story. Makinsons stats look as good a lomax in most departments but its where you make the breaks etc that can be match winners.
The two assists by lomax could be worth 12 points on the board which could make the difference in a game.
Even tackling stats can be misleading. Lomax made 2/3 try saving tackles in that game, add that to the two assists and he's man of the match.'"
The break Makinson made against the Dragons was superb and might have resulted in a try had Makinson not been stopped illegally, thus providing an opportunity for the Dragons to get their defences in order.
People are happily accepting everyone else's stats as legit. Why the resistence to Makinson's? |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 29214 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2003 | 21 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Nov 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Makinson is a decent fullback. I've been banging on about him playing fullback for years. I don't think he's quite as dangerous with the ball as Lomax is, but he's clearly a hell of a lot better than Wello. We have far bigger issues that whether Mako or J-Lo play fullback.
|
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 12189 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jun 2007 | 17 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jun 2017 | May 2017 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Saddened! "Makinson is a decent fullback. I've been banging on about him playing fullback for years. I don't think he's quite as dangerous with the ball as Lomax is, but he's clearly a hell of a lot better than Wello. We have far bigger issues that whether Mako or J-Lo play fullback.'"
completely agree, either at fullback isnt terrible, i just think J-Lo is a bigger attacking threat |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Board Member | 11377 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Sep 2002 | 22 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2024 | Aug 2024 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Saint Simon "completely agree, either at fullback isnt terrible, i just think J-Lo is a bigger attacking threat'"
He is. More evasive and more of a ball player. |
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16963 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2009 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2017 | Oct 2017 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: SaintsFan "The break Makinson made against the Dragons was superb and might have resulted in a try had Makinson not been stopped illegally, thus providing an opportunity for the Dragons to get their defences in order.
People are happily accepting everyone else's stats as legit. Why the resistence to Makinson's?'"
I've nothing against tommy, he's a decent player, I was showing how stats can be misleading at times.
If a player makes the same amounts of tackles but one player makes 3 try saving tackles then that stands out more.
Get what I mean ? |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16170 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: St pete "Get what I mean ?'"
I get what you mean but exactly the same principle applies to Lomax's stats, or indeed anyone else's. |
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16963 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2009 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2017 | Oct 2017 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: SaintsFan "I get what you mean but exactly the same principle applies to Lomax's stats, or indeed anyone else's.'"
Haha I was only using that as a example to how stats can be misleading. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 10399 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jun 2005 | 19 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
A full back shouldn't have to make any tackles. Every time it does it will be because of a failing of the defensive line.
Stats are very useful, but should never be used as 100% of your theory. They should be used to complement what we see with our own eyes.
Makinson is a good fullback - probably a better full back than a winger, but Lomax was a revelation with only a 4 game run there.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Star | 1220 | |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Sep 2010 | 14 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2023 | Sep 2022 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: SaintsFan "Jeez, you really have it in for Makinson don't you?
Here are some stats for you. They're only stats, obviously, but they are the only facts we have to hand.
Stats for Lomax in the Warrington game
No I don't have it in for Makinson, I just think his position is wing ( or maybe but I haven't seen him play there ) Not fullback.
Also, just picking one game and producing stats proves nothing. Makinson is an able young player who I actually like, Just not at fullback.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Player Coach | 16170 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: Top Saint "Also, just picking one game and producing stats proves nothing. '"
I did refer to another game. I actually compared his and Lomax's stats for all the games they have played at fullback this season and there isn't much to choose between them. I was extremely bored yesterday. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Coach | 7498 |  |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| May 2005 | 20 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Nov 2023 | Feb 2018 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote: SaintsFan "I did refer to another game. I actually compared his and Lomax's stats for all the games they have played at fullback this season and there isn't much to choose between them. I was extremely bored yesterday.'"
Stats arnt everything. Lomax looks a real threat at fullback and could potentially become our Sam Tomkins. Makinson looks for the most part solid and competent (nothing wrong with that). It's great to have options and cover and I really like Makinson but I see his future on the wing mainly or centre where I believe he played prior to the first team. |
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 25689 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2002 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
The difference between Makinson and Lomax is the genuine threat Lomax has with ball in hand compared to Makinson. Lomax attracts defenders and is able to either evade them or draw them in so the other backs have space. He also arcs his run or runs straight when he receives the ball on the edge which makes defenders hesitant and his pass selection is excellent. The stats don't shown this.
Makinson is a decent player to have in that position but there's no way he's as good as Lomax.
|
|
|
| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 12738 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jan 2024 | Aug 2020 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
|
| Milestone Years |
|
|
| Location |
|
| Signature |
|
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
last Fridays game against Catalan showed both Makinsons strength eg pace to make that excellent break, and also his major weakness at fullback, eg complete inability to draw a man and time a pass.
This weakness is very well highlighted in the blown play at the end of the match when Swift fails to take the stupid pass from Makinson. When Makinson receives the ball there are two players outside him and only one Catalan defender. All he needed to do was draw this defender and it was a walk in try for either the centre or winger.
The official superleague video below at 3 minutes 28 seconds shows this clear as a bell
www.superleague.co.uk/sltv?rD7UZYvehQk |
|
last Fridays game against Catalan showed both Makinsons strength eg pace to make that excellent break, and also his major weakness at fullback, eg complete inability to draw a man and time a pass.
This weakness is very well highlighted in the blown play at the end of the match when Swift fails to take the stupid pass from Makinson. When Makinson receives the ball there are two players outside him and only one Catalan defender. All he needed to do was draw this defender and it was a walk in try for either the centre or winger.
The official superleague video below at 3 minutes 28 seconds shows this clear as a bell
www.superleague.co.uk/sltv?rD7UZYvehQk | |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
