FORUMS > St. Helens > Lomax |
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| Lomax exceeded my expectations. Yes, he made a few mistakes (a couple of wayward passes from the dummy half and a dropped ball), but there were far more positives.
His kick returns yielded plenty of yards. This was because he a) positioned himself well, b) caught / picked up the ball early and confidently and c) ran elusively. When he needed to be brave he was and made at least one break because of it. During the first half he played it safe and concentrated mainly on defensive duties. But throughout the second he was up and around the attacking play like a bluebottle near a neon light. Whenever he did inject himself into the line he gave the defence a torrid time. With a bit more luck he could easily have had two tries.
Look, it's very early days. His diminutive frame raises questions about his ability to field high kicks (especially in wet conditions and under heavy pressure) and whether he can tackle big guys. Full back may not be his best position.
Out of the current crop of Saints kids he seems to have the most self-confidence (not that any appear lacking in this department). At times it looked like he'd been a regular for a decade.
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| Quote: Mugwump "
Look, it's very early days. His diminutive frame raises questions about his ability to field high kicks (especially in wet conditions and under heavy pressure) and whether he can tackle big guys. Full back may not be his best position.
'"
He is roughly same size and weight as Darren Lockyer, Billy Slater and Matty Bowen, who are quite a bit better than Paul Wellens at fullback.
The modern day fullback is not there to act as a shot stopper, he is there to be the leading edge of the attack.
We need to look more at what he offers in offence, rather than playing a big solid lad at the back.
The way Lomax attacked the ball when kicked to him was more in common with the Australian approach, of trying to take the ball at pace.
He fluffed it on occasion but considering his inexperience at fullback thats understandable.
Its also worth noting that at 18 he has plenty of opportunity to get faster and stronger as he matures.
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| Quote: The Chair Maker "He is roughly same size and weight as Darren Lockyer, Billy Slater and Matty Bowen, who are quite a bit better than Paul Wellens at fullback.'"
They're also not great [ibecause[/i they are small.
Quote: The Chair Maker "The modern day fullback is not there to act as a shot stopper, he is there to be the leading edge of the attack.'"
That's garbage. No one's suggesting he should be Andy Platt in defence. Or Garry Jack leaping for a high ball. But if he's a [iliability[/i in both areas it won't matter if he can slice silk as a "leading edge". He won't get in and nor should he.
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| personally i think the modern day full back needs solid 1 on 1 tackling and good positioning, a bit of pace and being able to catch a high ball. Lomax seems to have at least three and can practice under the bomb. His goalkicking ability is an important addition that we badly need as well.
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| Quote: JWP "Maybe so. you lot probably see far more of him for the reserves etc. It's just, as a neutral, your looking for something, not a polished performance as you know there'll be nerves etc, but something raw like, and he just looked a bit laboured to me, that's all. He worked hard enough, ran in the ball in full of zest etc, was probably a bit unlucky not to score, he just seemed to lack a bit of class, genuine burst of pace etc, y'know what I mean ?'"
We're dealing with potential here, not the finished product (and indeed, is a professional ever actually 'the finished product' or are they always learning and adapting?). I think he was full of zest. But he was not irresponsible. He worked as part of the team. The team were more cautious in the first half, it was a difficult game in the circumstances, and more expansive in the second (in part because Wakey let them, not being on the ball themselves given the circumstances). He made some smart moves and while one spotted break turned into a knock-on, the fact that he spotted it and had the balls to run towards the ball in the hope of converting the break into a try shows, to me, that he has the potential to make a good RL player. Apparently he has only started playing fullback in the reserves this season, presumably because the staff knew about Paul Wellens and his knee problem, so this was not only his debut but probably about his fourth game ever in that position. I'd say he did extremely well, especially given the big boots he had to fill. I hope he can kick on from here and just grow, both defensively and in attack. Time will tell and I sincerely hope Saints fans give him and the other young players the time they need. I suspect they won't have much choice, given that our injury list is ever growing.
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| Quote: Saint Simon "personally i think the modern day full back needs solid 1 on 1 tackling and good positioning, a bit of pace and being able to catch a high ball. Lomax seems to have at least three and can practice under the bomb. His goalkicking ability is an important addition that we badly need as well.'"
Yeah, his ability to boot the ball down the field stood out! He definitely can kick, that's for sure.
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| Quote: SaintsFan "Yeah, his ability to boot the ball down the field stood out! He definitely can kick, that's for sure.'" If he can kick a ball down field well he'll be on £500000 playing union in a matter of weeks!
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| Quote: Saint Simon "If he can kick a ball down field well he'll be on £500000 playing union in a matter of weeks!
Shhhhh! You might give the lad ideas!
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| Quote: JWP "Really ? I thought he looked pretty poor. I know it's naughty making judgements based on one outing on SKY, but I thought he was the weakest of your 'kids'. Even thing like pace etc, I thought he looked slow, when he made a half break in the second half etc.'" I think that's really harsh. He did make one or two mistakes, but I htough he looked pretty good throughout. Seemed to have threat when returning kicks, ran good lines when we were in attack making a few half breaks and as for pace - he was tearing yards off brough (who's quick) following his interception.
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| Quote: Mugwump "They're also not great [ibecause[/i they are small.
That's garbage. No one's suggesting he should be Andy Platt in defence. Or Garry Jack leaping for a high ball. But if he's a [iliability[/i in both areas it won't matter if he can slice silk as a "leading edge". He won't get in and nor should he.'"
You can coach a player how to catch bombs, and tackle, but you cant coach them to run 100 metres in under 11 seconds.
Considering he has only played a handfull of games at fullback he handled most kicks to him well. Certainly with more practise he should improve in that area.
He is also regarded as an enthusiastic tackler, and wasnt shown up on friday when making tackles.
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| Quote: The Chair Maker "You can coach a player how to catch bombs, and tackle, but you cant coach them to run 100 metres in under 11 seconds.'"
And all the coaching in the world couldn't have turned Steve Prescott into Paul Wellens.
He just wasn't big enough.
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| Quote: Mugwump "And all the coaching in the world couldn't have turned Steve Prescott into Paul Wellens.
He just wasn't big enough.'"
Again this is the British mentality coming in. If playing in Australia, Prescott would have been lauded for his offensive skills.
In Britain we slag him off because he cant stop Neil Cowie from five yards out.
The aussies dont expect their fullbacks to do that. They expect the players in the main defensive line from preventing such a situation happening.
The British fullback mentality is one that comes from Soccer culture where the Goalkeeper is a key component in a sides success. The ability to stop shots and organise defence is at the core skill of a goalkeeprs job. Its no coincidence in soccer that the teams with the best keepers generally win trophys.
We therefore translate those requirements in RL so that we look at the fullback as the last line of defence who has to make the key tackles and organise the defensive line.
There is also the fact that English teams are often poorly coached so when breaks are made they are often unsupported by their colleagues.
In Australia without its soccer culture they have learned that the fullback is the primary strike weapon. They appreciate the requirement for a layered approach to defence, but know that due to the quality of sides, that its more important for the primary defensive line to be strong, than the fullback be able to make a last ditch tackle 100% of the time.
Its rare in Australia for unsupported breaks to be made. If a player breaks the defensive line its try time, as a player will know that he has players in support and merely has to draw the fullback and hand the ball off.
Even if the fullback manages to effect the tackle from a break, the offensive team will have broken the defensive structure to such an extent that its almost inevitable in the next play that a try will be scored.
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| Quote: The Chair Maker "The aussies dont expect their fullbacks to do that. They expect the players in the main defensive line from preventing such a situation happening.'"
Well, thank goodness we happen to be living in the UK then!
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| Quote: The Chair Maker "Again this is the British mentality coming in. If playing in Australia, Prescott would have been lauded for his offensive skills.
In Britain we slag him off because he cant stop Neil Cowie from five yards out.'"
This is pure revisionism. If Neil Cowie five yards out on the hoof was the limit of Prescott's tackling abilities things wouldn't have been too bad.
The [itruth[/i was Prescott often struggled to stop players two thirds the mass at much greater distance.
Remember the hand-off Shaun Edwards floored him with on his way to the line at Knowsley Road?
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| View from a wakey supporter!
Granted he was playing behind a totally dominant pack (with KC running the show) and granted he made a howler.....but i thought he looked a really hot prospect and you guys have done well to produce another talent....full marks to the coaching set up at Saints
Some of the posts on here have knocked the lad, i'd have to say you must be getting a bit spoilt as i imagine playing your first SL game is pretty daunting and he did very well....
Most of the guys around me refused to believe he was having his first game and ended up convincing me that he was an aussie!
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