What transfer fees?
Depreciation on what?
What is CT and DT
Why a payment to Leeds RUFC?


100 employees doing what?
At an average of almost £29K per year.

Adding all your figures together including £1.6 million for the players wages then where has the other £4 million gone?

Quote: Rogues Gallery "What transfer fees?'" Leeds policy when they sign someone on a fee is to write the fee off over the length of that player's first contract. A reasonable policy - God knows who's in that figure in 2008. Last year of Gareth Ellis maybe. It's not a huge figure. Quote: Rogues Gallery "Depreciation on what?'" Something Wigan wouldn't be familiar with - fixed assets. Don't have the accounts to hand, but the Carnegie Stand will be a good chunk of it. Quote: Rogues Gallery "What is CT and DT'" Corporation Tax & Deferred Tax. Quote: Rogues Gallery "Why a payment to Leeds RUFC?'" I'd really love to know. They pay Leeds more in rent etc than Leeds pay them - but then again Leeds own the bloody stadium, pay Hetherington & the rest and they provide no discernable service to Leeds I can find. But they do lose lots of money so perhaps just need the cash. Quote: Rogues Gallery "100 employees doing what? At an average of almost £29K per year.'" Running a stadium/conference centre/cafe bar/Rugby League club/investing ****loads into the community game. You can email them all and ask what they're up to if you like. www.therhinos.co.uk/club/staff/index.php It seems to be beyond you but turnover of £10m is not coming just from matchday activities. Leeds have corporate facilities for 1,200 people per game - more, they are proud to tell us, than Elland Road and probably more than half the rest of the league put together. So they are ahead to begin with but those facilities then get used midweek for conferences/weddings/special events etc - as the link says, "non-sporting business, including conferences, parties and seminars still account for more business than any other sector". Generating that income costs money and putting on the events which generate that income costs money. One way of running an RL club is having overheads consisting solely of players salaries, a couple of ticket office girls and paying the rent on a stadium you don't own. Great - but you won't get the turnover to levels sufficient to do much else on the expenditure side then.

Quote: Rogues Gallery "What transfer fees?'" Leeds policy when they sign someone on a fee is to write the fee off over the length of that player's first contract. A reasonable policy - God knows who's in that figure in 2008. Last year of Gareth Ellis maybe. It's not a huge figure. Quote: Rogues Gallery "Depreciation on what?'" Something Wigan wouldn't be familiar with - fixed assets. Don't have the accounts to hand, but the Carnegie Stand will be a good chunk of it. Quote: Rogues Gallery "What is CT and DT'" Corporation Tax & Deferred Tax. Quote: Rogues Gallery "Why a payment to Leeds RUFC?'" I'd really love to know. They pay Leeds more in rent etc than Leeds pay them - but then again Leeds own the bloody stadium, pay Hetherington & the rest and they provide no discernable service to Leeds I can find. But they do lose lots of money so perhaps just need the cash. Quote: Rogues Gallery "100 employees doing what? At an average of almost £29K per year.'" Running a stadium/conference centre/cafe bar/Rugby League club/investing ****loads into the community game. You can email them all and ask what they're up to if you like. www.therhinos.co.uk/club/staff/index.php It seems to be beyond you but turnover of £10m is not coming just from matchday activities. Leeds have corporate facilities for 1,200 people per game - more, they are proud to tell us, than Elland Road and probably more than half the rest of the league put together. So they are ahead to begin with but those facilities then get used midweek for conferences/weddings/special events etc - as the link says, "non-sporting business, including conferences, parties and seminars still account for more business than any other sector". Generating that income costs money and putting on the events which generate that income costs money. One way of running an RL club is having overheads consisting solely of players salaries, a couple of ticket office girls and paying the rent on a stadium you don't own. Great - but you won't get the turnover to levels sufficient to do much else on the expenditure side then.

I'm assuming you don't have much involvement in running a company - high turnover is not just "free cash". You have to PAY money to support and generate that turnover.

Other than the ones I can extract due to various disclosures in the accounts I have no idea what Leeds' or any other club's detailed cost structure is like. But you'll have overheads such as advertising, repairs, rates, heat & light, travel & subsistence, security etc etc God knows how much cash just sticking on the floodlights for three hours or more every other Friday costs. And on the RL side, supporting the junior game, travelling to/from games, stewarding the ground etc. But more than any other figure will be cost of sales. Since a huge proportion of turnover is the corporate side of things you have the cost of putting those events on. Put on a midweek conference and you've got to supply food and drink, limitless prawn sandwiches, those flipcharts, little Headingley Experience pencils & pads, some kid to serve it up, someone to cook. Sell 40,000 shirts, say each one costs £5 to make and you've got a cost of £200k. Plus delivery from China.

The profit from all of which goes towards subsidising the cost of running a series of Rugby League teams at different levels. Because there's no doubt that taken on its own even with a salary cap that is going to be a loss making venture. Bundle the lot together and breaking even is probably the long term aim. Leeds, like most RL clubs, is not particularly run to make a profit although in this case the current owner isn't interested in providing support if they were to make ongoing losses either. So what a "normal" business might take as profit is ploughed back into supporting Rugby League/the club. If crowds or other turnover dipped for a sustained period my guess is Leeds would trim the community programmes as they don't generate any direct income. How much to plough into such, at a budgetary level, unrewarding areas is probably the conundrum most clubs face.

Salary Cap essential for long tem survival of game. Don't want to get back to the bad old days when the whole game was nearly bankrupt trying to keep up with Wigan

MJM
Why don't you just say 'I don't know' when you don't know the answer, instead of just making randomn guesses. Rogues' right, there's a lot of unaccounted money there. It would be interesting to know where it's going, especially seeing they post no profit at the end of the year.

He did.

You're nuts, they're not random guesses, those are costs every business in the UK has to bear. I'd like to know what you think Leeds are spending money on?

I notice Wigan have £4.6m of admin expenses in their last set of accounts. One could spend hours wondering what is in that but since their accounts disclose a lot less than Leeds' you'll come up with a lot less answers.

£4.6m admin most likely players wives and girlfriends

So what are you saying MJM? That Leed's unaccounted money has been spent on Wigan's admin expenses? Or are you just bringing in an irrelevence to hide the difficulty you have in saying - 'I haven't got the slightet idea what Leeds do with their unaccounted 4 mill, it's a real mystery, but it would be interesting for all of rugby league to know'?

He's already said that - I pointed this out earlier when you made essentially the same comment.

Jesus mate are you really so dim?

When your stadium is used 7 days a week it doesn't come for free. If you have a training course using the facilities whilst they may pay Leeds to use the premises Leeds have to then pay for all the asides that are required such as projectors, screens, pens, paper, tables, chairs, heating, lighting, cleaning, bottled water, buffet, etc.

You can easily see that the turn-over that Leeds attract has equivalent running costs that leave only a small operating profit.

Now what do Wigan and Saints spend their money on apart from wages?