That's an understatement.

Why is Lomax the most obvious? I don't get this line of reasoning at all. Lomax is so much a stand off as to be unreal but people keep wanting to put him at fullback. In Makinson we have a player who coped in his first Grand Final when dropped into the position having turned the game around in our favour, and he did a decent job there given his lack of senior experience in the position. We were winning while he was there until Shenton went off and we had to rely on Meli to defend our left edge. How can anyone then say Lomax is the most obvious fullback? It baffles me. Really.

I'm more inclined to wait and see how certain players perform with a new coach before having a clear out.

Spot on buster. McGuire turned a bunch of underperforming journeymen into champions by introducing organisation, and that is still paying off today. The Wigan squad, bar possibly the turd Tomkins, is no better, man for man than the Saints squad. If Brown is a top coach, he will work with what he has got. The likes of Perry, Shenton, Hohaia, Laffranchi are all internationals, he just has to get them to play like they still should be.

Genius. Comedy gold. You're typing this stuff but you can't believe it, surely?

Only Puletua and Roby would get into a first choice Wigan 17 on current form. We were poor on Saturday and still beat you comfortably. Are you seriously suggesting Tomkins - the best player in SL - is only "possibly" better than Wellens?

You have some decent players but your coaches are way behind the "Ape" and his team (you lot would do well to quit criticising SW, he's doing a really good job and it just makes you look as RL ignorant as the average Wire fan) so you aren't getting the best out of them. Added to this, your team lacks a real will to win and the continued selection of the likes of Hohaia and Wellens is as misguided as it is welcome (to Wigan fans!).

His argument is based on quality of player, not current form. It's quite possible that a good coach (and we believe we have one for next year) could bring the best out of our undoubtedly underperforming players this year, and if so it's quite possible that more than just TP and Roby would be shoe-ins for a merged Saints / Wigan side (god forbid that should ever happen!!).

Players like Perry, Shenton, Hohaiah, LMS, Wilkin are without question currently failing to replicate the performances that prompted us to sign them. Should a coach be able to relight the fire in them, they are 5 international quality players. Not to mention the improvements to the young kids in Lomax, Gaskell, Makinson, Foster, et al that a top coach can influence.

We're miles away... on current form. With each set of players firing, we're not quite so far.

Whilst it's all fine to pull the trigger on players in a forum as we all know the law and finance will not allow it.

You can't terminate contracts mid flow without shelling out and if you did the law would take you to pieces.

If you could terminate contracts then I would line up as follows

1. Lomax
2. Makinson
3. Turner
4. Wheeler (if he can stay fit if not a new centre)
5. New winger
6. Gaskell
7. New scrum half
8. La Franki
9. Roby
10. New Prop
11. Manu
12. Sia
13. TP

14. LMS
15. New Prop
16. New 2nd Rower
17. Josh Jones
7.

The truth is that many have believed the Saints publicity machine.

Hohiah - world class halfback.
Perry - enforcer prop.
Laffranchi - top class prop.
Solioa - world class tough player, (46 metres only 13 tackles, and 4 missed tackles, Hock laughed his b*ll*cks off at him on Saturday)
Wheeler - top class young player.
Flanagan - a major coup signing from Australia.
Roby - best hooker in the world.
Shenton - best centre in England.

Wake up and smell the coffee.

Its possible. Wello we shouldnt renew. Shenton could be offered to Cas free of charge, he'd be happier and so would they. Lance and Perry are more difficult. Unless they and their wives/girlfriend are homesick there's little we can do, but we can make life harder so they just leave. Lance or Perry wouldnt sit out their contracts in the reserves, they'd go home.

Hock had by far the superior game, but he took about 5 backwards steps when Soliola got in his face so hardly laughing at him. Watch the match and count them if you don't believe me, I can assure you I was laughing my testicles off at the time.

Basically you've made up some claims there, as usual. As for roby, just because you don't like him doesnt mean the rest of world don't, get over it.

Hardly anyone believed hardly any of that. Other than that, you're spot on.

Hohaiah was a signing most of us questioned, particularly as a HB.
Perry was an enforcer prop while plying his trade in the NRL, we're entitled to scratch our head on this one.
Laffranchi was a 2nd Rower we're expecting to prop, and in fairness he's going well, but no-one would have classed him as a top class prop. Because he wasn't a prop.
Soliola is quality.
Wheeler is a great young player, it's his injuries that have cost him.
Flanagan - pretty sure no-one saw him as a 'major coup signing from Australia' - he's a strong squad signing, and he's gone well so far. A monster in defence.
Roby - best in SL by a mile. That will do us. I don't see many arguing that he is better than Cam Smith.
Shenton - far better player while at Cas, so again he is a head scratcher, but I don't think anyone had him as the 'best centre in England'.

I don't know about Lance but Perry wouldn't. He's already whinged to the press about not being automatically selected when Royce was here. Boo hoo.

The problem is that Roby and Puletua still look like class players, despite the coaching and whatever else may or may not be holding players like Shenton, Hohaia etc back. Expecting the players that are underperforming to such a degree to find an improvement to bring them to the level of Roby and Puletua is a big ask. If Brown can pull that off it will be a far bigger achievement that the changes brought about by Madge at Wigan and with less strength in depth than MM inherited it looks like a big job for your new man.

I take your point to a degree but the nucleus of this side, but for untimely injuries during the game, would have won the GF last year.

Didn't Wigan finish 6th the season before Maguire came in? We'll do something similar this year, I imagine.

We're not a poor squad, we're an underperforming one. With a couple of additions, and if Brown can do what we hope he can, we'll not be far off.