For other clubs as they get shunted out...

It's a pity all these great players aren't getting a chance in the first team to continue the "development".

Oh ok, but reading both yours and Rogues comment's both sides fielded numerous players in the under 20's who also qualify for the under 18's. Saints to my knowledge fielded no players with first team experience, while Wigan fielded only one, ala Karl Pryce.

The only players in the Wigan squad aged over 20 were Pryce and Veivers, Saints may have also fielded some players 20 years or older I don't know. What I would say is both those sides who took to the field on Saturday were pretty even and comparable, yet one side ran out convincing winners.

But I think most of the Wigan players were born a few days earlier than there Saint's counterparts, so obviously there age and maturity won them the game.

The reality of the youth system is that it should be about development. However, if only a few clubs are producing "teams" of the required standard then it becomes difficult to know at what stage the kids actually are, because they are not getting tested week on week.

At the end of this year the Aussie schools (U18?) are coming over. Then we may get a pointer as to what level of the likes of Rhys Evans, Lee Gaskell, Ian Thornley etc are at.

I'm sure "the eclipse" should he read this will give us a far better insight into what we are likely to face.

Carl Forster and Gaskell are the 2 standouts from Saints.No one else of note really from saints.

Carl Forster is superb and could be another James Graham imo. I keep saying it but look out for our U15's this year.

Is Carl Forster the hooker or am I getting mixed up with another Carl? If it is then he didn't impress me much last year but he may have been playing under age.

No, hes a backrower but can play anywhere in the forwards, but hes never played hooker. Hes a fantastic prospect and the penrith coach said hes the best british player of that age group he has seen for years.

Im sure he will be a wigan fan though eh rogues

I'm amazed at the number of people who are ALREADY writing off Dixon and Ashurst. Look, ANY forward who is competitive at SL level BEFORE he reaches his final growth phase (depending on the player - somewhere between 21 and early 24) is going to be a good SL player.

That final phase - when the player seems to "fill out" almost overnight - is essential and can add anywhere up to a stone and a half to a body frame. For instance, look at Scully before age 23 and after. The difference in power, explosiveness and yardage is practically black and white.

Right now both these kids are performing well. Indeed, they are even weighing in with a respectable number of tries and assists. But just wait till they fill out. The contrast will be prodigious.

Agreed.

In fact, I'm amazed at how quickly some fans write off young players per se. It's like they expect them all to be Murphys overnight.

Agree. Dixon and Ashurst have done OK for me. Sure they're no world beaters yet and maybe they may never reach that stage, but without being given a run in the side and given time to develop they'll never be that.

Another poor result for our u18,s we lost 34-32 against Leeds away. That twice in a row we've conceded 34 points.

Plus point is that josh jones scored 4 trys our England youth captain is a class act. He is still only 16. I think that's 7. Tries in 3 games for him. Very classy centre.

It's always difficult with the junior levels (18's and 20's) because you are never sure of the relative ages of the teams.

For example Saints may have had mainly 16 year olds in their teams whereas Leeds may have had the majority if their team 18 years old.

A couple of weeks ago Wigan played most of their second year lads (U18's) v Salford and and racked up 78 points.

A week later they played most of their 16 year olds and just beat Wire. As we have said many times it's about development at this age but the games do need to be competitive.

Will, that defeat make it difficult for Saints to make the top half of the "split"?