Agreed. Much more likely to kick for Makinson than take on the line.

a) how would you remove him from the squad?
b) who would you replace him with?

I like turner - but he's had a few stinkers since returning from injury. He's recognised that, put his hand up, but now he has to perform. On form he's as good as any (bar Watkins) in the league, but his range of performance is much broader than most, because when he's not he's one of the worst!

Good to see that he's acknowledged it and is prepared to put his thoughts out there. Next step is to do it on Sunday.

I think Turner is a decent centre personally. He's not Matt Gidley or Jamie Lyon but few are. I think he's improved throughout his time at Saints and this season he's starting to show some nice touches in the centre position. Tommy Makinson is scoring regularly out side him. Sometimes I wish he'd back himself a bit more though but as I say, his winger is scoring plenty of tries.

Defensively he's been poor of late and that was an issue at times last season. As a team though we defended very well early on in the season. Against Salford he was up against Gareth Hock and did well. It's probably against the more structured teams where he struggles because he does have a habit of misreading plays. I'm hoping that the defensive side of his game will improve as time goes on but we'll have to wait and see.

He's the best right centre we have and hopefully he can continue to learn and build.

Good post.

I was only saying the other day that he needs to back himself a little more. He's big and fast enough to break the like if he applied himself a little more.

Turner is a player who essentially sums up the "not playing his weight" concept. He's a very, very big man, and athletic too. With his size and speed, he should be making busts frequently, but as others have said, he rarely breaches the line.

He does have a good offload out of the tackle, though, which accounts for much of Makinson's tally. But I see him as an average centre overall. I think Percival and Jones offer more in attack, and are no worse in defence.

I certainly disagree with the assertion that on his day he's as good as any in the league. I think there are quite a few centres better than Turner. Sadly, none are available as far as I know.

We had a solid centre in Shenton and look @ him now at Cas. Granted he got a bad injury and his confidence seemed to suffer. Short sighted from saints?

Some people just don't fit though.

Shenton never really hit the heights he did at Cas.

Absolutely. We should definitely have kept him. He was playing well towards the end and played very well in the Grand Final. His injury was unfortunate but his lack of success at Saints was due largely to the general mess that was our side in those days.

Shenton was the finished article who didn,t get any service from the halves. Turner is very much Work in Progress and has loads of potentional.
I reckon if you asked Miracleson who he would prefer, in my opinion he would say Turner, another 1 or 2 years development and thses two will be a great partnership.

On the other side Percival and Swift have great footwork and are similar in needing 1 or 2 seasons of progression.

We will have one of the best 1,2,3,4 and 5 in superleague shortly and. i think Turner should be part of it.

(On paper)

I rate all four players highly but it's a massive stretch to to say you'll shortly have the best 1-5. They are all young players and you have no idea at this stage whether they'll all pan out or not, or even whether they'll all stay at your club if they do! Leeds 1-5 are the best in SL at this moment in time and if you want to compare future like for likes with Wigan, for example, you have Lomax v Hampshire. Anyone willing to call who will turn out the best there is a braver man than I, for a start, and Bowen, at his NRL best, is a league above either at this stage of their careers. Burgess looks the better player v Swift at the current time but, of course, the same caveats apply. Then there's Makinson v Charrnley and, as much as I rate Makinson, currently you would have to be seriously biased to take the youngster over the Superleague's top try scorer for the last two seasons and current international. That's not saying Makinson won't turn out to be just as good of course, just that at the moment he's not proven over time whereas Charnley is. Turner was a poor second (or even 3rd) best, not only to both our centres on Friday (and has been hit and miss prior to that, off what I've read on here) but also to our 2nd row turned centre for the day, Bateman. Not the most compelling reason to put him in 'the best 1-5 in superleague' if we're being honest. As you point out, Percival didn't play so, to date, we have little direct comparison apart from last season when he wasn't as effective as either of the Wigan centres but, again, he seems a good prospect and could certainly go on to eclipse either or both.

Now, I do realise you said 'one of the best' rather than the best but what exactly does that mean? 3rd best..4th best...or were you intimating that they were destined to be the best? Obviously the above is only relevant if it's the latter. However if it's somewhere further down the pecking order I'm not sure what you're point is in the context of this thread. If it's, as I suspect, that you were suggesting they would shortly be the best then I think you're way off the mark as things stand. They are still some way behind the Leeds 5 and, currently no better than Wigan's.

I realise that the above reads as though I'm putting the young lads you have coming through down. Nothing could be further from the truth. I think there's some real quality in there. Lomax, in particular, has always impressed me. I just think to say 'shortly have...' as you did is pushing it a little.

Our backline is now better than its been for years, but lets not get carried away. Wigans young backs look very good, but Leeds backline is a class above IMO.
Ours can still improve, but its very young and very raw still

Currently I would say Saints back line is in the top 3 this season, I would agree that Leeds look to have that top spot at the moment.
For actally finishing by way of tries Saints are riding 2nd at the moment, but as mentioned earlier these Saints backs have not played the current weaker teams of London and Bradford yet.
Once the Percival and Swift partnership is developed we might see a shift from big powerful wingers to the more athletic, evasive type of back play.

One thing that (with a notable exception in 2005) annoys me at Saints is we dont put teams to the sword. Wigan racked up a massive score v Bradford, but you can guarantee we'll either field a weaker team or if we start winning comfortable, we'll pull lots of stars off and cruise home.
I can of course see the benefit of resting players, even half way through a game, but every now and then i'd love to rack up a massive score