Ok, I would take issue with a few of your choices, but you support my point. From the Goons you would keep 9




From Saints you would keep 13


Now maybe this is tinged with Saints specs, but the fact remains that our squad really is no worse than the Goons, but as a team, they are better by a fair distance. For me therefore, the difference is coaching, fitness, and everything that goes to turn a bunch of journeyman pros into a champion side. Wigan are better at Saints at that part of the club, and we need to recognise thqat the days of having an all star team are past, now we have to do the best with the players we have available.

I had this same argument early in the year when insane saints have made a massive mistake in signing Laffranchi who's a backrow to replace jammer.

I listed about 6 props that was off contract and moved clubs and the was (off the top of my head) about 15 props that joined other clubs.

Can't remember them a but off the top of my head - griffin, hill, Lauaki, gill dudson, Ben flower, Brent kite, Jason king, Andy lynch (went for fee), Bryce Gibbs.

The bulls signed at least one prop, London signed two props and can't be bothered thinking of others but the was 100% props avsilabke.

We were in for Griffin, Hill also went for a fee IIRC, it was the reason I was told we didn't go for him. Wire swooped and were willing to pay the fee.

Dudson and Flower have hardly played (and isn't one a second rower?) I wouldn't have touched Lauaki with a bargepole.

I'm not sure any of those others who we could have signed, seeing as we haven't any quota space and that discounts the Aussies you've named would have improved us at all tbh.

Hill's fee was the value of his contract and I'm sure I read it was in the region of £10,000. We could afford that surely. He's a player who is going to give Warrington at least 8 years of quality rugby if he keeps developing as he is now. It certainly wasn't the hundreds of thousands we paid for Scully back in the days when we wanted to win trophies.

We've just made a £2 million loss, maybe we couldn't.

One thing you need to take into consideration when comparing statistics with Wellens and Brett, is that TS plays Brett mostly in the big games against the best sides when its more difficult to score trys , make metres etc etc. Whereas Wellens has played most of your games which include the likes of Broncos, Widnes, Wakey & Cas against whom it is easier to make hay.

It has been rumoured that Saints offered Brett a 2 year contract before he resigned for Warrington. Who would you rather play FullBack for Saints, Wellens or Brett?

We did have a quota spot for a prop but it was taking up by Laffranchi who's a backrow.

I'm totally shocked that we replaced James Graham with laffranchci.

I totally agree we really should have brought in an all action front rower to replace who was the best Front Rower in Super League. That was a major blunder in my book.

are you lot still trying to convince your selves that player for player you have the better squad?

here my list:

tomkins
charnley
goulding been fantastic this season and is a true
carmont wish he was only 23 so he could carry on
pat richards when fit
finch
tommy
smith don't know why you lot don't rate him because looked very good so far and i wouldn't swap him for any of your halves
lima
McIlorum
mossop
hock
hansen
o'loughlin

and as you have included fringe players in your list

dudson
farrell
powell
hughes
thornley/gelling

but lima and tommy are leaving. finch hasn't signed for any one yet and carmont hasn't decided

are you lot still trying to convince your selves that player for player you have the better squad?

here my list:

tomkins
charnley
goulding been fantastic this season and is a true
carmont wish he was only 23 so he could carry on
pat richards when fit
finch
tommy
smith don't know why you lot don't rate him because looked very good so far and i wouldn't swap him for any of your halves
lima
McIlorum
mossop
hock
hansen
o'loughlin

and as you have included fringe players in your list

dudson
farrell
powell
hughes
thornley/gelling

but lima and tommy are leaving. finch hasn't signed for any one yet and carmont hasn't decided

We should have least got the best prop available.

Ive allways said Andy Lynch would have been ideal failing that Chris Hill......

Hull paid a big fee for lynch so he was a no go.

Hill in hindsight would have been perfect but nobody knows how a young prop coming from a lower league will adapt to super league.

Jason king or kite would have been ideal, both are top quality props and both offer good leadership.

They may not be cheating per se, but anyone looking at the depth and quality of Warrington's squad and the seemingly never ending stream of quality players they still continue to be able to bring in and fit under their cap might find cause to wonder how exactly they manage it... Either Warrington is an utterly spectacularly fabulous place to play RL in and players are happy to accept less of a wedge to go there than they could get at other clubs, or their accountants, HR and lawyers deserve Olympic Gold Medals...



Agreed - a desperation signing. But sadly further proof of the lack of available quality that we had to go out and pay a lot of money (ambition again anyone?) on a wild punt on a player to play a non-natural position to him as there was simply noone else available.



Disagree - Flanagan is a very good grafter who'll only get better under a non-clueless coach. LaFranchi has been a very good signing - maybe not the ultimate answer at prop but a fantastic signing nevertheless who'll do big things for us next season used properly.



Again: what players? We desperately need a half and frickin' Smith was the best player available for lawk's sake. I'm frankly more than happy that we didn't enter a bidding war over him as he just wouldn't have been worth it. We haven't got the money to pay a fee for Brough or Chase (even if the rumours of Cas wanting rid at a cut-price are true). We've no quota for an Antipodean (curse the skies for Hohaia again). Who else is there? The reason we panic-signed Hohaia is that there just isn't anybody. Criticise the reliance on the youth policy if you like, but giving another season to see what Brown can make of Wheeler and Gaskell is by far our best option right now.

True. That's down to coaching/tactics, training/fitness and psychology/motivation, 3 areas we've been way behind the curve on for a long, long time. It is not down to basic player quality of player. Only the basic superior quality of many of our players has kept us in the top 4 and in trophy contention since DA left. How many other first-team squads in SL could have finished 3rd last season and 4th this with the kind of injuries we suffered last year and the appallingly limited tactics this? Warrington and noone else, and we've established that we simply don't have the money with 2 million a year losses and a brand new stadium to compete with their bottomless pockets and loophole-finding. Put Hock or Carvell into our setup and they'd look demotivated plodders lacking aggression in big games that you'd be screaming for us to be rid of in no time. Put Wilkin into either of the W's setups and you'd be enthusing about him as the kind of player Saints need to be showing the ambition to go out and sign inside six months. Wholesale mass personnel changes are simply just not the answer - making the most of what we have most definitely is.