There were a minimum of eight. I might have forgotten some. Knocking on eight times, not under pressure either, is no way to win any game much less a knock-out match, especially when at least three of those knock-ons happened in attack on their line.

Saints make all those meters but just don't do enough when they get there.

I also think Wigan share the workload better than saints do.

I said at the game that Roby and Puletua were your best players. Both of them are awesome.

I don't rate Wilking but 50 tackles is fantastic.

We had a very slow start to the season, which could be attributed to a number of things. I was personally tearing my hair out and we we lost to Quins at home I threw my toys firmly out of the pram! Since then we have improved immensly, though, and the rugby's been enjoyable to watch.
We seem nervous when we play Wigan. The fact that we had all that possesion early on without scoring, only to manage two slick tries when it looked as though the game was lost, sums that up for me.
As fear the Vee said, we've a poor record against our top 3 competetors, and if we don't win on Friday I'll be mighty dissapointed, but we've seen off the next best (Leeds in particular) reasonably comprehensively.
We're behind where we could be at this point with Royce, which is a shame, but I think the longer we go through the season the closer we'll get to the best. Hopefully with a settled off season we'll hit the ground running next year (and as a bonus we'll not have an opposition team coached by McGuire) and be a true force, rather than an also ran. I do think this squad could win trophies with Royce as coach.

Pryce is class, he'll have his edge back by the end of the season so those gaps he saw he'll get through again (assuming his injury hasn't ruined him, but I'm sure it hasn't). Leon is as hard to handle as any back in the league. His mere presence with the ball cracked Catalan t'other week.

Not one will slag off Wellens excessively, as he's a club legend, but i'm afraid the ball dies when it gets to him. Against lesser defences, he gets that extra split second to make things work, but not against the top teams. He wasn't helped on Saturday by the fact we seemed to be using the same move time and time again so we weren't exactly foxing the defence, but I reckon if eastmond had been at #1 we have likely cracked you at least once in that period of territorial dominance.

It's tough with a player like Wellens - but someone needs to have the balls to drop him for the big games.

You don't get scared as an opposition fan when he tries to chime in to the line.

Its was a split discussion for posters wanting to stick with Wellens or go for Eastmond at full back (who wasn't actually available in the end). I'd plump for eastmond every time. I don't know whether he'd have taken Charnley down when Wello did, but I reckon he'd have done better for Charnley's try and I think he could have broken the deadlock in the 1st half if we'd had him attacking.

Of course he would have stopped Charnley. Charnley made a right mess of it. He should have run inside more to open up the space to go outside Wello, but he didn't, he just ran in a straight line and didn't do anything. He's not a natural winger, no in and out style in his locker. His second run was just embarassing defending.

It just shows that stats do not cover having a cutting edge and true game breakers. The stats prove that we do not need to "work harder" or "complete our sets" but actually find a way to open a defense with a single play.

We need to let go of our safety blanket Wello and get an extra playmaker on the field.

We did need to work harder - than the previous time we met Wigan (Stobart). But Pryce let us down badly on Saturday and so did Wellens. Between them they created a series of errors, which was very disappointing given the dominance of our forwards (the thing we had lacked last time we met the goons).

If we manage to put together the hard work in the forwards AND creativity in the halves/fullback, we will beat Wigan. We have the right game plan; we just need the execution to take our chances when they appear.

Nail on the head. Our pack did their job, and the likes of Martyn/Long would have had a field day in the first half. The platform was there for all to see.

Sorry but I think that's unfair and copmplete bandwaggon jumping. The tackle he made on Charnley was full back play of the highest order. If the rest of our defence had got back as quickly and covered as well as he did we wouldn't have conceded that try. People are saying what a great game Meli had but he was the person who was asleep when Charnley went through that gap.

Agree on the first point however I think you have to give Charnley credit for a great step which beat both Meli and the cover. The pointsl remain about Wellens though i.e. his lack of pace means the ball dies with him whenever we're in a situation where some speed is required which is either linking up on the outside or returning the kick. He's still great powering through tackles but it's not enough anymore.

The thing with Wello is that the game has moved on. Fullbacks are no longer the RL equivalent of a goalkeeper in footballer. They are not there purely to take down defenders that break through. They are now a third halfback, like the looseforward is now a third prop. The fullback is now arguably the most important attacking weapon in a side as it's much harder to defend against their linking into the line. We just don't have that in our nal with Wellens in the side, he's too slow and far too predictable and doesn't contribute enough and leaves us looking helpless in attack because we've got 12 blokes in a line and no threat from fullback.

Even if the development of the sport hadn't changed the role of the fullback, Wello still isn't playing well enough to stay in the team. The tackle on Charnley in the first half was magnificent, but he used to do that week in week out a few years ago. He's missing more tackles than ever now and for 99% of the tries we concede he arrives in the area just as the player is touching the ball down. He's also not the safe pair of hands he used to be under the bomb, he's dropped more clangers this season than he has in his entire career.

It's hard for Saints fans because it's Wello. A local product who has given his all for the club and who has produced some sensational performances and seasons for us in the past. I love the man, love him to bits. But if he was any other player in any other position he would be booed and he would be the scapegoat for our woes this season.

For the sake of the team he has to go. He cannot be the first choice fullback next season.

I was told from a very reliable source that he asked to move to 13 at the start of either last season or the season before. May be this time....

Under Royston's back on the bench policy he's absolutely perfect. Wello could cover 1,3,4,6,7,9,11,12,13 allowing us to have 3 bruisers on the bench.

But the club hasn't shown any hints so far that he will be moved or replaced at fullback.

I think he'd be a waste of a spot on the bench. He'd come on and make no impact at all. We want a sub that will make a difference and IMO wello wouldn't.