Think some of the comments on here are pretty harsh tbh. We've been crippled with injuries and had to throw in a load of kids. We've played all our games this year away from home. We've had the off field sagas that have caused problems.

And yet we're still in third place and have a great chance of a good run in the playoffs.

I was happy with the performance yesterday and had Wigan +20 points before the game. The one major difference between the two sides is Tomkins. If he can stay fit and keep his form Wigan will be a force for a decade.

My only concern is Wello. He needs to hang up his Fullback Boots. The lack of pace at the back is what kills us imho.

Are we going to blame injuries every time we lose or is something wrong with the coaching staff ? www.saintsrlfc.com/news/page/1122

Are we going to blame injuries every time we lose or is something wrong with the coaching staff ? www.saintsrlfc.com/news/page/1122

I'm not blaming yeterdays loss on the injuries, we came up short by 6 points to the top team in the competition. Some on here will say use terms like an average side, or a team that needs 5 or 6 players.

This actually shows how out of touch as fans we have got from what it means to be lower down the league than the top 2.

If you think this team is average, then actually we should be 7th. Look to 7 and 8 and you will see an average team. People throw around terms like average, without actually thinking of the meaning. What they mean is that we are not the top side in the comp and anything less than the top side they rate as average or less. This is hugely OTT in my opinion, but that's what forums are for, opinions.

From what I saw yesterday there were 2 defensive sides on top for most of the game. With Wigan having that little bit extra than Saints at crucial points. ie Charnley and Tomkins, but both could have been stopped.

As for replacing the centres, what we are saying here is that we have a top 2 english centre and a top 2 exiles centre (meli would have been centre apart from King having to give up his wing spot), which is not good enough. Therefore we can only top this by either signing Carmont or an Aussie as everyone else would be below Meli and Shenton.

I can understand the call for a prop,

All year I've heard calls for we need Leon back, to only a week ago, telling the board we must sign Leon, to the very same people saying he went missing yesterday. Lets be thankful the board are not so short term, otherwise we would be hiring and firing on a week by week basis. We were good, yesterday ,but not good enough.

We where a vast improvement on the GF from last year, and an improvement on MM and the wigan game after the exiles. I would say we where not as good as at the DW. But this is far from an average team and there are still enough games left to mount a challenge for the playoffs.

The rest week of the CC final will do Graham the world of good, last week he could not run and at half time this week he could not even see. Leon was 3 games back. These are not excuses for the loss but reasons why we may yet improve further this year in the final 4 games.

It's always depressive to lose to Wigan, but lets not go OTT we are off the pace, but hardly and in summountable position to pull back this year, never mind next year.

Royce after the game made some excuses with the injuries and that's the first time this year he has done that IMO. But afterwards I was thinking about it and was that speach more for him or for the team, so that they don't get into a mentality that Wigan can't be beat. More just we got them at the wrong time for us and we still can beat them. It's impossible to know a mans mind, but he does not often draw attention to the injuries.

Fans are fickle. I think yesterday was too much for Leon given that he has only just returned from a year out. He was clearly match rusty - his passes were off and he made wrong calls. That's to be expected. But the fact was he didn't play well and that was a problem for us. The right wing got no ball, etc. It's all understandable but still a valid point.


He should point out our injuries IMO. They have been very influential this year. Particularly he should point out how seriously injured Robes and Jammer were because that speaks to their commitment and the fans should know the degree of their commitment especially given our loss and the closeness of it (in spite of all the problems).

I prefer a coach not to blame injuries like potter, Anderson and millward did. Sure a coach can bring it up but it's getting a little boring now hearing royce go on about injuries.

Injuries are part of the game and we should just get on with it instead of making excuses.

Who will have the "kicking game" for Saints next year.

Yesterday your kicking game was terrible.

Thats another problem we have. Lee Gaskell has a very good long kicking game but I don't expect him to be playing.

From listening to Royces comments and from what I've heard coming out of saints means that lance and lomax will be the halves.

Hi all new to this forum and not been posting for long. 
I feel that as a team we are short of winning honours but not far off. 
Backs - we lack that bit if x factor ( I know thus has been discussed in other threads ) but with a few changes we could go from been good to great. 
Lomax - full back for me would be fantastic there but he has the talent to be fantastic in whatever position he plays. I think that as a club we need a long term strategy for player recruitment to decide his best position so we can leave him there to let him truly develop into the world class player he has the potential to be. Then recruit what we need and where so he isn't shoved from pillar to post. 
Makinson and Gaskell - both have shown they could be more than good enough for saints and for a long time to come. Think they could both do with a dual reg contract to let them develop both as players and physically. Makinson for me is a future centre with pace which is something we haven't had for a while. Gaskell could easily develop as a classy 6. 
Wheeler - if he could stay fit I would not be too worried about weather pryce leaves or not as he is probably the most naturally talent player we have but his doctors notes must resemble 10 years worth of casualty scripts and this is a worry now as it has been going on for too long. Granted his last injury was a bit controversial to say the least but yet again he has been injured for too long. Next year must really be make or break for him at the club
Foster - long term winger for me. Yes he isn't the fastest winger but he is young and a points machine. Wello never had pace from day one but he used to beat the first defender on kick returns regular until recently so pace is important but points are more so. 
Shenton - classy player but needs more service. If he had a real flier outside him then that would give us dangerous flanks to attack from that offer different threats allowing us to vary our attacking options instead of being a bit predictable. 
Pryce - if he stays great if not we need to know and get an adequate replacement ASAP. I cannot think of who tho. Ratchford would have been my choice but he is wire bound now. 
Hohoia - until he arrives no one knows how he will go but his support play is good from what I have seen.  He is also a regular of NZ and is versatile so he can't be that bad and he is pacey. 
Meli - been a revelation at centre and if needed can always go back on the wing but only if we were desperate. 
Gardener- been a good servant but I think makinson has already overtaken him and should be released. We need a winger with pace some one like briscoe, broughton, or Watkins. If anyone can think of someone else then fair enough. 
Wello- time to be replaced with lomax IMO. However this should be done gradually because there will be times were the games will be tight and his defence positioning and experience will be vital. 
Forwards - j know this has been done to death but we need another prop griffin for me.
Flannery- even tho he has signed a new deal I would only play him when others need a rest. Just cos he is an Aussie doesn't make him a world beater. For me he is an over rated version of ashurst/ Dixon. 
Ashurst / Dixon- play them regular or dual reg them as this season has done them no favours at all. Could be great could be gash but without regular game time we will never know. 
Wilkin - class. This years has been his best in a long time just needs to keep it up. 

Tp/ Roby- class no need to comment further. 
Soliola- exceeded my expectations just needs to pick his big hits better to avoid missing the tackle. 
Lms - good first season and hope he keeps it going. 
Perry- really needs to show his true class. But don't think he fully recovered for his injury at the end of last season. 
Laffranchi-  think he will go well for us but time will tell.
Flannagan- think he will prove to be our best signing tbh. He is young and has played well for wests (not so much this year) and is a tackling machine. Takes flannery's place for me. 
Magennis - lots of potential but his first full year really so will improve for it. 
Moore - awaiting outcome of his court case. I would like to keep him as is aggressive and plays at a good tempo. Wait and see. 
Clough- keeps getting better every year. Defo should move up to prop IMO. 
2012 for me:
Lomax
Winger
Shenton
Meli
Foster
Pryce ( wheeler if pryce goes)
Hohoia
Perry
Roby
Lms
Soliola
Wilkin
Tp

Laffranchi
Flanagan
Clough
Wello

That leaves Any other new signings plus every one else to fight it out for a place In the 17

I think Royce has used the injuries as a excuse to many times this year. Abd I also think he's ott after the game when he's talking about injuries.

Great post

He has mentioned them a handful of times and it is right that he did. They have been massive and it's been blatantly obvious to everyone. Jammer and Robes were playing with serious injuries and their courage should be mentioned; as should the courage of other players who were not fit but who put up their hands to play. I think that speaks to our character as a team and it is THAT which he referred to in his post match interview - our courage.

Our long kicking game was, bar one from Pryce. But Wilkin's grubbers earned us three dropouts, which I wouldn't call terrible.

To be fair, until the 2nd half the kicking game for Saints was pretty irrelevant, we made the hard yards up field well and Wigans kicks all went to hand starting us on the 20 or 30 or 40 m lines.

We put up a few shocking bombs, but really both of wigans first 2 tries where from deep so a good kicking game would not have really impacted territory wise as we had territory and possesion in spades.

As I had only returned from hols on sat I was watching on TV and it was interesting to hear Milward saying we where too lateral. And after the game Royce said pretty much the same. Lomax was making the passes for Leon but basically everything went the same route, as when Lomax and Gaskell played. Part of bringing Leon back was to open up the other flank, not just do the same routine.

I don't think Leon is the messiah and the key player needed for next year, but neither do I think he is as woeful as has been suggested yesterday.

The question for me is does Lance bring a kicking game? We saw yesterday 4 wigan halfbacks all with kicking games.
At Saints we have runners of the ball and people who are creative with ball in hand, but our main kickers where on the bench and at loose.

I think we have the players, but balance is key. In the off season every single half back should be working on their kicking game. With the exception of Gaskell who needs to work on his defensive positioning. But no point having great half backs all doing the same job. Lomax or Lance or Leon, would be my options next year. But that has a provison on one of them having a kicking game. Otherwise Gaskell has to be fitted in somewhere, for some of the games where kicking will be vital.

I think the coach is better than most and he has moved a little on not playing 3 props from the start yesterday. But in such a key game, with Roby and Graham shot to pieces why did clough play so little and why not another forward? I understand he likes a back, but with it being sooo clear the forwards where a little underdone, why no other forward for this one game.

But hey ho I still reckon we'll shape up well against huddersfield.

I would imagine because our harassed coach was trying to figure out how to balance everything, including the management of returnees from long term injury of which he had two, one of whom was failing to have any positive impact on the game at all.

I feel dead sorry for Royce Simmons. He's had a miserable first season with us. I hope it is a gazillion times better in 2012. In all respects.