Let's look at this without sympathy and nostalgia. Wellens' time has come and he's no longer anywhere near the player he was. He's had 17 years at the top level which is a damn sight more than many players get, if he was playing at the standard he is now in that first year he'd have been at Rochdale or the like within 2 years.

The only time he should be in that team is if a raging virus takes out 17 players one weekend.

Having said that, if he is providing valuable experience and learning to the younger players I have no real issue with him being in the squad.

The way I see it. You need to play in different positions to be a utility player. Based on all the years I've been watching wello, he can only play fullback.

He's not a utility player. IMO he's just a squad player that should only play if we have dire injury problems.

Sadly it seems Brown thinks otherwise

He's going to be on the bench IMO.

One thing that did occur to be when watching this video www.saintsrlfc.com/news/page/3707 and from being face to face with Wello is that he is surprisingly bigger, in terms of muscle mass, than you realise. If you look at other FB’s in SL and the NRL they are very slight and light weight these days eg Tomkins, Slater etc. Now I know Wello is no spring chicken and has never really had pace but if he is going to be back up for 1 or 6/7 or anywhere in the backs shouldn’t the conditioning staff be downsizing him to gain speed from shedding the muscle mass?

One thing that did occur to be when watching this video www.saintsrlfc.com/news/page/3707 and from being face to face with Wello is that he is surprisingly bigger, in terms of muscle mass, than you realise. If you look at other FB’s in SL and the NRL they are very slight and light weight these days eg Tomkins, Slater etc. Now I know Wello is no spring chicken and has never really had pace but if he is going to be back up for 1 or 6/7 or anywhere in the backs shouldn’t the conditioning staff be downsizing him to gain speed from shedding the muscle mass?

Wello is a fullback.

He's never been a utility.

I can remember his initial outings as a half all those years ago, I genuinely wondered if he had a future for us.

Instead he made the fullback position his own - defensively a rock, offensively a genuine try machine at times.

200+ tries for saints.

His decline reminds me of Joynts latter years.

Joynt finally found a way to adapt and give us a swansong and we were a far better team then.

I'm not sure wello can - not just physically, but positionally the modern game doesn't suit him.

His decline is exaggerated all the more because

The fullback role has changed so dramatically during his decline.

He's spent his entire career with us so we have seen the talent rise and fall.

The clubs recruitment across the team has been shocking for 5 years, and the much vaunted youth seems to be blocked by his continued participation.

And we've not tasted success in years so he's pretty much the last link to all those glory days.

Fullback is still where he is most effective.

So he should back up there or not at all.

I'll start off by saying that for me, he shouldn't be in the 17 for the Warrington game. Not influential enough to start, and with Masoe/Walmsley on the bench that final bench spot is crucial. We'll have to wait and see how that develops, but it's pointless criticising his inclusion before the first squad is named. As I've said before, he has taken a few sacrifices behind the scenes this season and I can see why the club have made the decision they have.

The way I see it is that we have a player at the club who knows exactly what it takes to win trophies with the club. He understands what is required. Anyone who speaks/knows him will tell you that if he wasn't in the first team he would be in the West Stand with us for the Wire game. He knows what the expectations are and what it means and takes to represent the club. With the emergence of younger players this season that could be influential in ways we won't necessarily appreciate. They will learn a great deal purely by watching the way he trains and conducts himself. He'll want to be in the 17, of course he will, and if he is picked in the 17 on form that I don't see how people can have an issue with that. If that makes me one of the 'sentimental group' then so be it, but it's my opinion.

What I'm saying is that we will have to see how it develops with him before jumping to conclusions. He was our top try scorer in 2012 wasn't he, playing at full-back? I could have sworn he won the MOM thread against Leeds (I think) playing at full-back last year? He scored a double in Perpignon when he came on. We could have a worse second choice, although we do have the option of playing Lance at full-back and Wheeler at stand-off if needed. Likewise, I understand the argument regarding the lack of pace/running threat in the halves without Lomax at full-back. I don't think he's as poor as people believe, but I don't think he is worth of a place in the 17 if everyone is fit. Maybe I'm slightly biased, and I'll admit that I've always had a soft spot for players who are prepared to go out and run their blood to water for the club, but we'll just have to see how it develops.

Rumours up here he could be coming to haven on a month to month loan

That won't happen, He's still the captain

Just about spot on, good post

I disagree. Sprinters are now adapting the Usain Bolt physic. I'd say around 70% mesomorph 30% ectomorph. Afterall muscle mass is heavy and its finding that balance not to have to much muscle that it actually works against you by slowing you down. Amongst other sports, sprinting has changed alot in terms of training and physic over that last 15 years. If what you say is true then who is faster at their peak? Ryan Hall / Josh Charnley or Darren Albert?

Darren Albert all day long and very slight in physic