FORUMS > St. Helens > Wilkin |
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| Quote: Mugwump "For the past two, maybe three, seasons Wilkin has consistently been one of the hardest workers at the club. You'll struggle to find players who are more involved than he is over the 80 minutes. When he's not tackling, he's charging down a kick, or taking the ball up, or supporting the ball-carrier, or kicking etc. He's also one of the toughest defenders at the club. You never see him go missing when the opposition forwards have a head of steam up. He's bloody fearless - despite not being the biggest second-row in the world.
The fact that all this has passed you by doesn't suggest we should put much faith in your powers of observation or analytical skills henceforth.'"
I didn't say he didn't work hard before, but its much more obvious this season, especially defensively. It's not passed me by at all, i just feel it is much more obvious this season than the past few seasons. A lot of fans consider Wilkin to be just a ball player, but he is proving them wrong, and he is now being noticed for putting in the graft as well as the the fancy stuff.
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| Quote: saintc "ccording to this
I was just going to have a look at the stats. There it is then, Wilkin is definatly working harder this season (than last season anyway), especially in defence. My observation and analytical skills mustn't be that bad at all then.
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| Quote: saint billy "I didn't say he didn't work hard before, but its much more obvious this season, especially defensively. It's not passed me by at all, i just feel it is much more obvious this season than the past few seasons. A lot of fans consider Wilkin to be just a ball player, but he is proving them wrong, and he is now being noticed for putting in the graft as well as the the fancy stuff.'"
You're right that many fans think of him as a "ball player". I don't know where or how this label got started, but it's wrong and has been a millstone around his neck. Wilkin is a modern RL second row/loose forward. He is multi-skilled with no significant weaknesses. But being able to pass without weakness does not make you a ball player - and being a ball player doesn't necessarily mean you can pass without weakness. At the heart of the definition lies the question of natural ability. A ball player is someone with innate talent for passinig - long, short, quick, cut-out etc. You can be a good passer of the ball - but this may well be because you've spent eight hours a day practicing since the age of six. A [inatural[/i ball player is someone who can demonstrate a range of passing seemingly without effort or practice and has the ability to see and hit (usually through heavy traffic) players other passers miss entirely.
Harry Pinner was a ball playing loose forward who could split defences apart with a variety of passes, but he - unlike Wilkin - had significant weaknesses in his passing game (he left himself wide open to interception). Andy Gregory was a ball player who similarly terrorised defences - but he had to turn his back to deliver a right-handed cut-out pass.
Wally Lewis was one of those rare players who was a ball player without any significant weaknesses to his passing game. Which is why he was so good.
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| Quote: Mugwump "You're right that many fans think of him as a "ball player". I don't know where or how this label got started, but it's wrong and has been a millstone around his neck. Wilkin is a modern RL second row/loose forward. He is multi-skilled with no significant weaknesses. But being able to pass without weakness does not make you a ball player - and being a ball player doesn't necessarily mean you can pass without weakness. At the heart of the definition lies the question of natural ability. A ball player is someone with innate talent for passinig - long, short, quick, cut-out etc. You can be a good passer of the ball - but this may well be because you've spent eight hours a day practicing since the age of six. A [inatural[/i ball player is someone who can demonstrate a range of passing seemingly without effort or practice and has the ability to see and hit (usually through heavy traffic) players other passers miss entirely.
Harry Pinner was a ball playing loose forward who could split defences apart with a variety of passes, but he - unlike Wilkin - had significant weaknesses in his passing game (he left himself wide open to interception). Andy Gregory was a ball player who similarly terrorised defences - but he had to turn his back to deliver a right-handed cut-out pass.
Wally Lewis was one of those rare players who was a ball player without any significant weaknesses to his passing game. Which is why he was so good.'"
Like i said, he is proving them wrong this season by working much harder in defence, hes showing that hes not only this ball player that people think, and hes playing much better because of it. Wilkin can be a ball player, he can quite easily slot into half back if it is needed. He's got that ability to be a ball player, but this season it is far more noticeable that he is working much harder and he is looking a better player because of it. Not only can he use the ball, he can also put in the hard graft that is required of a back row forward.
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257.jpg "Those who lightly give up their liberties in the name of safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.":257.jpg |
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| This season Wilkin is averaging just shy of 41 tackles per game, which in anyones book is outstanding.
In 2006 he averaged 22.8 tackles per game, in 2007 27.8 per game and in 2008 26.5 per game. These are very respectable figures for a second row forward.
I just hope all this extra defensive effort does not detract from his key role in the team which is producing the 'fancy Dan' stuff.
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| Quote: Saint Rabban "This season Wilkin is averaging just shy of 41 tackles per game, which in anyones book is outstanding.
In 2006 he averaged 22.8 tackles per game, in 2007 27.8 per game and in 2008 26.5 per game. These are very respectable figures for a second row forward.
I just hope all this extra defensive effort does not detract from his key role in the team which is producing the 'fancy Dan' stuff.'"
Watched him for this, was second top tackler at Wakey.
Top tackler was none other than Matt Gidley!! 27 tackles!
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| Could the increase in tackles be indicative of the amount of ball we are giving away compared to 2006, 2007 as much as anything?
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| Quote: St Ty "Could the increase in tackles be indicative of the amount of ball we are giving away compared to 2006, 2007 as much as anything?'"
Possibly or should I say more than likely. If you've got the ball you won't be making tackles and vice -versa.
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| Quote: St Ty "Could the increase in tackles be indicative of the amount of ball we are giving away compared to 2006, 2007 as much as anything?'" Perhaps an increase in time he's spending on the pitch? Its very rare for him to be spelled these days, but it did used to happen.
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| Quote: Saint Rabban "This season Wilkin is averaging just shy of 41 tackles per game, which in anyones book is outstanding.
In 2006 he averaged 22.8 tackles per game, in 2007 27.8 per game and in 2008 26.5 per game. These are very respectable figures for a second row forward.
I just hope all this extra defensive effort does not detract from his key role in the team which is producing the 'fancy Dan' stuff.'"
I think its making him a much better player. He's been doing quite a lot of kicking and still doing the fancy stuff, but now hes also working much harder. Those figures, just prove my point above. This season he is working much harder and is doing his fair share of graft as well as the fancy stuff.
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29116_1284298794.jpg "Goooooood afternoon sir/madam":d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_29116.jpg |
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| I Like Jon Wilkin And Won't Mind Having Him In The Leeds Rhinos 17 But I Fear He Is A Kevin Sinfield Type Player Who No Matter How Good They Are In Super League Will Never Set The World On Fire Internationally...
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| i'd have to agree, he is a great utility player, but in an international setup, his lack of a speciality place makes him hard to pick. Not a 6 or 7 but possibly too small for an international forward either?
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| Agreed. Whilst a superior club/league player, he seems to get outshone at international level by more workman-like players such as o'loughlin and westwood.
Perhaps as he gets toward 30, he'll get thatlittle bit of extra bulk to help him step up better?
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| For selfish reasons, i hope he doesnt play for england is more refreshed for saints!
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| Quote: The Joker® "I Like Jon Wilkin And Won't Mind Having Him In The Leeds Rhinos 17 But I Fear He Is A Kevin Sinfield Type Player Who No Matter How Good They Are In Super League Will Never Set The World On Fire Internationally...'"
I think that's an uncharacteristically fair comment.
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