...and as always we hit the uncomfortable question of who, without the benefit of hindsight and a time machine, you think would have been better signings for us to replace them all at the time... It would have been hilarious reading on here if Eastmond had gone to Warrington on a long deal and we'd been stuck with Smith instead for instance wouldn't it?

I'm with Northampton Saint in most of what he says. Perry and Shenton were good signings on paper and Eastmond was a more than capable replacement for Long (although we didn't really prepare for his departure despite all the signs that it was coming). I think everyone was happy with those signings at the time. Add to that the signings of Soliola and Manu and we've done some ostensibly good business over recent years - we've just been a bit unlucky in a couple of cases.

However, I think it's clear that Hohaia and Laffranchi are where we went wrong. I had my doubts about signing Hohaia as a half-back, on a four year deal, when he'd never played there professionally before, and some others on here did too. Similarly, I thought we were getting a good player in Laffranchi, but there was always the concern that we were replacing a world class prop in Graham with a toiling second rower. Again, plenty of people commented about this at the time. What's most significant is that they are both non-fed players, and since signing them we've been severely restricted in what we are able to do. Had we hung on a bit and waited for the right people to turn up (i.e. a real scrum half and a real prop) we'd have been far better off. We might even have been able to pick up domestic signings, which would have left us room to strengthen other areas with overseas players. As it is we completely tied our hands.

No arguments from me - Hohaia always looked iffy to me and LeFrank ain't really been the replacement for Graham we needed either. But again: who else (assuming we needed to offload Pryce) could we have had any better at the time? Could you imagine being a member of the Saints board 2 years ago knowing you were about to lose both of your starting halves at the end of the season with only unknown kids available to replace them for an entire year? They had to sign someone and so panicked and signed the only vaguely quality player on the market right then that could play #6. They made a **** decision, but under the circumstances and without the benefit of hindsight I doubt many of us would have made a different one. C'est la vie.

The problem with the recruitment and my biggest gripe, is not replacing players with quality when players left. We've gone about 6/7 years without a out and out centre pairing which IMO is shocking!

We failed to try and replace the the likes of gidley, scully, graham, long etc who was massively important to us. I know we could never replace scully, longy and KC with equal or better players but we should have gone for the best we could.

McManus said "we are going with youth" but what he really means is we are doing it cheap and hope we drop lucky. I wouldn't mind if he'd been honest and cane out and told us that we are doing it on the cheap because of the stadium but he didnt, in fact he told us "we will have a team to grace the stadium"

I pretty much agree with Northampton Saints comments re signings etc

I would also add that i think that although Daniel Anderson and Mick Potter were fine coaches, they were from the Brian Smith school of coaching.

This is a school that trumps size and power above speed, agility and footballing brain.

The ultimate result of this has been seen in Saints fans complaints about dour one up rugby, all bash and barge and no pace in the backs. Daniel Anderson escaped much criticism, as the team under him were near invincible. However a look back on websites and you will see pockets of fans bemoaning the spectacle.

Royce was then brought in to change things. I think he was trying to do that, bt for whatever reason the players didnt seem to understand or agree with what he was trying to do. The end result was player power allegedly saw him off.

We now have Brown, and we have seen at Huddersfield that he likes three quarters with pace, he likes to have a half back with a strong kicking game. He likes a creative loose forward. He likes mobile hookers and he also likes a big aggressive pack.
Given time i think Brown will build us a team in the mould that Saints fans desire. Whether he is a coach good enough to bring us trophys however is another matter. His record in Australia was solid rather than inspirational.

The replacement or lack of it with Talau, is not down to being unfortunate.

Whilst it's fair to say we would have been annoyed if Eastmond signed a long term deal with Warrington, he did not sign a long term deal with Saints. It was not so much about keeping Smith or Long, but not telling them to go before signing up Eastmond on a long 4 year deal. If he stuck to 2 years then you need to hedge and keep Smith, Pryce and Eastmond. All 3 could have been accomodated.

Same with Leon he could have been kept. Going for Lance made no sense as a half without any hindsight. Had he been signed as a FB, for an outgoing Wellens then fair enough.

Laffranchi again a good signing but why would we sign him to replace the best prop in the world (arguably). There was the likes of Griffin and Hill I think even Carvell may have been up for grabs at the time. So whilst we could not sign a prop of Grahams ability, we could have bought him in the aggregate.

Perry there is no fault with a quality buy, for the right position but just did not work out, same with Shenton.

If you have ever watched Moneyball, then you could say Saints are guilty of doing a similar thing, we have been looking to sign names, as opposed to buying wins, by going for effective players in the right positions, rather than big names who play in slots that are already covered.

For me, it all started when Scully retired. Near impossible to replace though. IIRC we have not won anything since have we?

I want us to go back to basics and recruit players specifically for certain positions. By that I mean I want two actual wingers playing on the wing.

I want two actual centres playing there. I want 2 out and out halfbacks playing there. I want 3 or 4 no nonsense props playing there. It's hardly rocket science. Even if they aren't world beaters; even if they are merely "solid" in that position, it will be a position where they have trained all their career.

I am fed up of seeing us trying to put a round peg into a dodecahedron hole. Enough trying to do this on the cheap all the whilst ruining kids careers.

I just want to see an honest to god RL team.

fwiw RE: Griffin there was an interview with him a while back (can't remember where) when he said he shook hands on a deal with you guys, then decided to join Leeds at the last minute instead.

From seeing what he did at Hudds I suspect that isnt browns style though. I agree with you though, it's what the goons have done and it's working ok for them at the moment.

Went chasing the money and got shafted. No sympathy for players with that attitude.