I don't understand how you can say he hasn't improved us in the last 3 years. Are you not aware of what position we was in before he took over? I'm pretty sure you aren't that clueless. We may not have made any finals but we have almoast been there which is a dam sight better than before he was here. Our youth system has also improved since Noble's been here from the 18's, 21's and plenty of those who have featured in the first team under Noble.

Noble is a good coach as his record shows. People forget he's taken Wigan 80 mins from the last 2 grand finals and his record at bulls is also pretty good.

On noble not building a good squad, I wonder how many of wigans signings have come from noble.

Since he came we've been 80 minutes from the grand final (twice) and eighty minutes from the Challenge Cup final (twice).

The reserves last year won the grand final and are through again this year.
Th academy team reached the grand final last year and are through to the elimination semi this weekend after finishing second in their league (with a very young side)

I'd give Noble one more year but it isn't going to happen. Watch out for a big shake up in the coaching regime(s) at Wigan.

Correct, I can say in very high confidence that Piggy wasn't Noble's first choice. Noble wanted Ennis who signed for the Dogs but IL wouldn't pay the money, however Nobby did want Higham out though and the pig is an improvement on Higham but needs to improve more next year.

I think K Pryce is definitely an IL signing, although worked together at Bradford IL made his reasons quite clear at a recent shareholders meeting as to why he gave Pryce another year extension, my doubts still remain on him.

I think Phelps was a Noble signing, he seems to be a player very much like Withers who can play in a variety of positions and has found his spot at fullback, also along with Carmont who with those 2 have been a couple of shrewed pieces of business thus far. There have been a couple of bad signings like Withers, Mathers, Smith but all where gambles that didn't pay off and wouldn't have been on a big wage anywah compared to other senior players. I'd personally like to see Noble given another year or 2 at least as its 2010 and 11 when another 2 or 3 of the higher paid players will be off contract, which Noble didn't have any control of previously.

In all I'm pleased with the job Noble has done at Wigan and although we haven't won anything we have certainly moved forward since he took over.

I think Wigan's youngsters would get to GFs playing in their slippers. What is surprising is how few of them Noble has brought up to Super League. He seemed reluctant to promote Tomkins and has kept back Ainscough. Compare that to Saints or Leeds and it's clear that Noble focuses on SL so he's not a good choice to build a club. Celtic beware.

How do you work that out?
What about Prescott, McIlorum, OCarroll, Joel Tomkins and Harrison Hansen.

How come all those great Saints youngsters Dean, Wheeler, Ellis, Ashurst and Dixon were playing against Wigan reserves on Saturday?

Rubbish, Sam Tomkins had already started more games than Tim Smith even whilst he was here before his injury at Hull KR, 9-7 in fact and even then Sam was on the bench if Smith was starting. If Sam was starting Tim Smith had been dropped to the reserves due to poor performances and was struggling to get back into the first team. Shaun Ainscough got found out in a couple of key games where we should have won, and even when he scored 4 tries, against Wakey away he still has got plenty of work improve on. Noble in his time has either brought through or developed players into better players: Prescott, McIlorum, Sam Tomkins, Mark Flanagan, Joel Tomkins (who Millward almoast ruined ) , Lee Mossop, O'Carroll, Ainscough (still developing).

That's 8 players in Nobles time that he has brought into the first team which for me is a good amount as you are finding out for yourselves and we have in the past that you can't bring in to many.

I don't know why you have highlighted that bit of pilgrims post, I think that part is correct. If Smith hadn't got injured perhaps Noble would probably still be using him as your your starting half-back and Tomkins wouldn't get a chance. ( I can only go on what was happening before Smith got injured). As for Ainscough, he looked superb early on.(If anyone can say, hand on heart, that Roberts has been better than those early performances, then fair enough, but I don't watch Wigan every week).

As for you comparing your named 5 'youngsters' to our 5 youngsters you compared them with.... 2 of them are nearly 24, 2 of them are 22 and a bit and 1 is nearly 22.
Out of Saints 5 you named, 4 are all under 20 and one is 21 and half.(If we are talkig 23/24 we might as well include Hargreaves, and the 2 last winners of MOS to the list. ).
Give them a couple of years and I'm sure they will reach the dizzy heights of your Wigan 'youngsters'

And you are wrong, even before Smith got injured at Hull KR Sam still had more starts than Smith and IMO would have continued to do so as when Smith was poor he was dropped to the reserves. It's just that people like to make things up and would rather have a go at Noble rather than looking at the facts. Some Wigan fans make me cringe when they don't check up on things first and jump onto the bandwagon along with them 2 clowns on sky.

I agree with some of what you are saying , but you are, conveniently missing a couple of things out to back up your point.... I think Smith probably missed the odd match due to injury prior to Hull KR. He also missed matces on compassionate grounds as well (both of which would have boosted his appearances).a And when you say ' When he was poor, he was dropped.' You know as well as I do that he was playing bad for a while and the fans where slagging him and Noble off for playing him ahead of Tomkins, before he was dropped!

simply a no

Dean and Wheeler are just on their way back from injury; Ellis has only had two games so far this season and the playoffs are not the time to be integrating newbies; Ashurst and Dixon are both contracted to the first team and have had lots of game time due to injuries. They are both young players promoted from the academy squad and so they should not be over played at first grade level. We have had Fas and others back recently and they should rightfully play since that is what we pay them well to do.

All our young players have done very well in what have been very trying circumstances for them this season. At no time have any of them shown themselves up. They have not had the luxury enjoyed by Sam Tomkins of being protected and assisted as they have been integrated. Due to our awful injury situation at one time they were all just thrown in at the deep end. Hopefully, assuming we don't suffer yet another injury crisis next season, we will have a better chance to see what they are all made of next season when there will be a more settled team playing.

Of those you listed, Wheeler is the stand out player at present. He settled right in and won the confidence of fans very quickly. He is a year older than the rest you mention, being of the same cohort as Eastmond. Wheeler has a rugby brain, good hands, quick feet, has pace and can kick when called upon. He also is totally committed, enthusiastic and seemingly will injure himself rather than concede a try. I'd like to see him play more games, which he would have done this season had he not been blighted by injury, because I really think he is a talent.

Nail on head, really. Particularly the bit about Wheeler. If Gaskell is able to make the step up, then things will really start to get interesting.

That's an interesting take on events. In the last two seasons, Leeds have put wigan out of the playoffs. In 07 Leeds were beaten by saints in a bruising game the previous week; last year we were absolutely hammered. On neither occasion was Noble able to take advantage against a team on the ropes. If he had done so, then you, not us, might well have won both GFs.

2009-2006=3. Four years ago was 2005. This is not a disputed fact so, yep, you are going senile.