I'd have Turner tomorrow thats for sure. Masoe is taking time to bed in, possibly due to his injury.

Lets just say i'd put good money on a fully fit 2014 Shaun Wane led Wigan team beating a fully fit 2010 Maguire led Wigan Team, despite the 2010 Team having a lot more individuals technically superior to those playing now.

And yet, Hohaia was superb in that match against Leeds.

I feel sorry for Luke Walsh. He thought he was coming to a team on the up! More like on its uppers.

I think Brown has confused the hell out of Saints.

I agree.

all very different from a few weeks ago when you were unbeaten and ripping it up

fickle or what?
see you friday

Just listened to browns interview.

Apparently he told the players at half time why we aren't as good as Wigan and Leeds.

Looks like that was taken fully on board by the players. They came out with a refreshing attitude.

Brown's a great motivator, don't you think?

Was that the right approach? Surely its better to try and 'build them up' not knock them down, regardless of how true it might be or not.

After all it was only 18-6 down, a quick try for you and it was game on!

"Home truths" are for after the game surely?

You'd have to say that it's the wrong approach. We came out worse.

I just can't see where we go from here. I can't see us winning a game of importance where we need the right sort of attitude. Is that a coaching or player issue?

More important was his comment after the game

To what does he refer to there? Is he talking attitude and commitment by any chance?

More like avoiding responsibility for his own mistakes.

After a few hours of reflection, I still feel as frustrated as I did after the first 15mins of the game. Wigan showed last night how you turn up and compete with a "bigger and better" team and simply out muscled and out enthused a more experienced Leeds side.

As has been said on here, watching saints through the early 90's, you would have seen a part time Saints team get demolished by a full time wigan side time and time again, but you couldnt imagine the likes of Roy Haggerty, Paul Forber, Bernard Dwyer, Paul Bishop, Shane Cooper putting in a completely inept performance as we have seen today. They may be outclassed, or outplayed due to the differing fitness levels, but they would never have shown such a woeful lack or heart or commitment. What they lacked in a level playing field, they more than made up with their attitude and a desire to "give it a go", which is what we saw from the Wigan kids last night.

As much as I dislike McIlorum, when was the last time you saw any of our players stand up to Jamie Peacock and take him off his game? Answer......never. Where is Sonny Nickle when you need him. Im all for respecting the opposition, but there is a big difference between respecting them and being in awe of them and quite simply, our forward pack is second best to Leeds, Wigan, Warrington and Huddersfield. From what Ive seen over the weekend, Id say Cas also had a better pack. When push comes to shove, we will be lucky to finish in the top four this season and after such a good start, that makes it all the more frustrating.

There is no short term fix for our problems, sacking brown will mean Rush appointed again and we will revert back to the team running the team, rather than one man in charge. The old boys club at saints has a lot to answer for and has been responsible for our issues over the last 5 years, particularly the performances that got Potter and Simmons sacked. We now seem to be doing the same in order to force the Chairman to do the same to Brown, rightly or wrongly, this is like Turkeys voting for Xmas. My question would be, what do the players actually want in a coach? It seems no one is good enough and it doesnt take long for the senior players to lose faith, as a result, they lose the dressing room and then the team capitulates. We have seen it time and time again. Unless as a club we invest in a coach that doesnt take any , and the chairman backs him and his decisions 100%, we will be forever in this downward spiral.

Its clear Brown cant motivate the team, nether could potter, neither could simmons, yet we keep appointing the same "type" of coach and then complaining that we arent getting the best out of the team......why??

Finally, as everyone knows we are desperate....thats DESPERATE for a 6. There must be someone knocking about in the Championship that can do a better job than HiHo and take some of the pressure off Walsh. I wouldnt be surprised if he does leave at the end of the season, why would you continue to get battered week after week when you are surrounded by such woeful and enthusiastic-less players?

Best squad in SL? A truly great coach would have Saints walking SL?

Honestly, part of the problem Saints have is that the players believe this hype. Even if it were true - which it isn't, both Wigan and Leeds /have better squads - that you had the best squad, they would still have to put in the hard yards and play with passion.