I agree with McClennan that we have a sound base that, with a bit of tweaking and augmenting, could go on to produce a title winning side. But Brown isn't in the same situation McCrae was in when he took over. McCrae inherited a side with some genuine superstars in it (Cunningham, Goulding, Martyn, Newlove) - and a supporting cast of very good players (Sullivan, Hunte, Joynt, Perelini, Gibbs, Prescott). At the moment we've got one player who would fit into the first category (Roby) and a handful who would fit in the second (Puletua, Soliola, Manu, Lomax?, Wellens?). That '96 side just needed some direction and discipline. This side needs more than that. We're lacking someone who can dictate a game and more generally we could do with a bit of flair and unpredictability.

On the plus side, we consistently produce a higher standard of young player now than we did then, and we also have more strength in depth.

I thought there first season was the first super league season ?

Not sure like.

Nah, they all signed for the 94-5 season.

We finished third, not fourth, in 2011 and 2012, and this year we were ejected from the CC in the quarters, first time in 12 years, and didn't make it to the GF, first time in 7 years, so I'd say that we now have a less likely 'base' than we have had in a number of years as we achieved less than we had been achieving for years.

Unless, of course, we achieved less this year because we had a terrible coach.

Whichever is the case, the proof of the pudding will be in the eating I guess.

McRae brought in Derek McVey, who was outstanding, particularly in the early games of that season. I remember him pretty well destroying the Goons early in the season, and getting us on a roll. McRae also brought in belief, and started the era where you could never write off the Saints. What we did have then, was a Bobby Goulding who not only fired up the team, but also the fans. Best atmosphere I have ever known was in or around the 96 season.

Oh for a half back like Bobby Goulding or Tommy Martin or Sean long now that is essentially what we are missing. Sound base yes, But world class 1, 6, 7, 9? just 1 out of those 4

If this is true, I think we have done very well to finish continually in the top 3 for the past god knows how many years...would say if Brown can keep us in top 6 with that poor quality team he should be made Sir Nathan!!

IMO we lacked an out and out "coach" towards the end of the season...think Rushy and KC did a good job with their experience but it showed in playoff game vs Wire that Smith got them fired up for 2nd half and we came out flat. We have the quality to compete with Wigan (weaker than last season), Wire (not strengthened and old guard another year older) and we demolished LEeds both times we played them last season...if NB can give us something extra motivationally and make one or two minor tweaks to how we play I am confident we will see some silverware in 2013 (as long as Wello manages to make it up the stairs to collect it before 31st December )

Do we need world class players in those positions to win trophys? Or to look at it another way, which of our opponents have world class players in thoem? Leeds? Wigan? Warrignton? I would say Wigan have Tomkins, who is potentially world class, with three make weights in the others, Leeds have 4 players who aren't world class, and Wire have 4 good, but certainly not world class, players. If we had Scully, Long, KC and Tommy playing at the top of their games, we would walk the league by a mile, but we really don't need players of that quality to win trohpys in today's league.

Leeds combo of Hardaker, McGuire, Burrow/Sinfield is so far ahead of ours that it's laughable to even compare them.
Wigan HAD Tomkins, Finch, Leuluai, which again makes ours look ridiculously poor by comparison
Warrington have Hodgson, Briers and Myler, which bar possibly Myler is again far superior to our own

I've left out 9 as it it the one spot in the key creative positions in which we are ahead. Looking at those names listed, it's no surprise we're the one team out of the 4 to not win a trophy in the last 4 years. Wigan may struggle a bit, particularly WHEN Tomkins leaves, but we shouldn't be using the fact that other clubs are going backwards as a reason to put up with our frankly shocking creative players.

There is a reason why you are just a random on an internet message board, instead of a head coach.

Come on then Wayne bennett, tell me how you would produce some creative players out of nothing. Tell us all how easy it is when there are none available

You can achieve less and still have a sound base for winning the title. I doubt Leeds fans are saying they've no chance next year yet they finished fifth in your Super League.



It is.



That '96 side needed defence. The year before it was awful.

Classic.

1 - Drop the door mat
2 - Play Makinson at fullback
3 - Promote Lee Gaskell to 6
4 - Play Hohaia from the bench

Boom! Two of the 3 problem positions are sorted. And that's before I go hunting for players.

Realistically the club has to do the above. It also has to start getting itself in gear with recruitment. Good players ARE, ARE, ARE, ARE, ARE, ARE available. In the past few seasons we COULD have signed Hardaker, Ratchford, Eden, Hill, Dureau and Bateman, for a combined outlay of about the equivalent of a Ford Mondeo.

True.

Big difference here: they have actually won the title in recent years. We haven't won so much as a Blue Peter badge.