FORUMS FORUMS



  
FORUMS > St. Helens > Half back situation
148 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , BackrowSaint
RankPostsTeam
International Star2681No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Mar 201114 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017Jul 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Top Saint "I have to say that I only partly agree with this. Lance cannot be blamed for the lack of half back options for the first part of the season, Gaskell was his partner then. Lomax started playing better when Hohaia was moved to stand off for the Leeds game. We started to see the best of him while Lance was first moved to stand off. Maybe that is as much to do with ' A change is as good as a rest '. What has happened is that Lance hasn't got any better at stand off with more games as many would have expected. The Initial change effect has worn off and Lomax is finding that he has to do most of the organising and playmaking ( Not his natural game ). What is the answer? I think it may work if we swap Wellens and Lance around. Wello was a junior grade Stand off and unfortunately his diminishing lack of pace can no longer be covered by his excellent positioning and defence. I also think Lance needs the playmaking and kicking responsibilities taken away so he can concentrate on finding some form.

Only a thought!'"


I didn't say it was all his fault icon_wink.gif

I don't think moving Wellens is the answer tbh: for me Wellens either plays at FB or not at all.

RankPostsTeam
International Star1220
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201014 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Feb 2023Sep 2022LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Albion "I didn't say it was all his fault
99.99% of all complaints with regard to wellens is his lack of pace. No one ever questions his commitment, skill level or desire to win. Lance is clearly ( to us fans at least ) not working at stand off. Wellens has covered there in the past. ATM anything is worth a try. Our lack of organisation and go forward in attack means doing nothing is not an option. I must be one of the few on here who doesn't rate Gaskell at stand off so personally I wouldn't have him there ( Been tried, Doesn't work ). Last season for me was just an all round backs to the wall effort by the whole team. Gaskells shortcomings were glossed over because of the very low expectation level and lack of pressure which comes with that.

That leaves us with a choice of the 3 W's. Wellens, Wilkin or wheeler? I think we need wheeler at centre ATM ( to replace Shenton who is poop ) and Jones keeping his place. Wilkin is ok but unspectacular, so would have to be Wellens for me.

Last thought!

Roby at stand off and Hohaia Hooking. eusa_think.gif

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach10399No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200519 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2016Jul 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Top Saint "snip'"
To be honest, Wellens lack of pace isn't what concerns me. He can still tailor his game to get the best out of himself by playing clever around the ruck in attck and looks nice and solid again under the high ball.

My bugbear is that when it gets to him at 2nd pivot in attack, the play dies. That's as much to do with his handling not being as slick as, say, Brett Hodgson's as it is to do with lack of pace. [iIf[/i he had electric pace, it would go away to making up for this deficiency, but he hasn't.

I think Makinson, Wheeler, Gaskell, Hohaia and Lomax would all deliver more in that attacking position out wide imo.

I think we're all agreed that Lomax and Hohaia in the halve is too limited and we should bring Gaskell in. I'd play one of Lomax and Hohaia at 1st receiver and one at full back.

RankPostsTeam
International Board Member11377
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2024Aug 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Offside Monkey "I'd play one of Lomax and Hohaia at 1st receiver and one at full back.'"


I'm still of the opinion that playing Lance as an impact hooker is where we'll get the most out of him, with Robes moving to LF whilst he's on the pitch (or even getting a well earned rest, heaven forbid!)

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach10399No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200519 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2016Jul 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: FearTheVee "I'm still of the opinion that playing Lance as an impact hooker is where we'll get the most out of him, with Robes moving to LF whilst he's on the pitch (or even getting a well earned rest, heaven forbid!)'"

I'd go with that(I like Lomax at #7 - I think he can do a great job in the right partnership), but I'd still change out the fullback.
Whether it be going with Makinson for pace or someone like Wheeler for craft and evasion.

RankPostsTeam
International Board Member11377
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2024Aug 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: Offside Monkey "I'd go with that(I like Lomax at #7 - I think he can do a great job in the right partnership), but I'd still change out the fullback.
Whether it be going with Makinson for pace or someone like Wheeler for craft and evasion.'"


I'm not convinced we need to replace Wello at FB, he has lots of good points. We just need to tweak out predictable backs moves to involve him at an earlier point rather than at the strike end.

If we did bite the bullet and replace him, my only concern would be at right centre, where a decision would have to be made, a a choice between Clough/Magennis on the bench:

Makinson
Gardner
Shenton/Jones/Flannery/Wellens (my personal preference would be Jones, then Shenton)
Wheeler
Meli
Gaskell
Lomax
Perry
Roby
Laffranchi
Soliola
Flanagan
Wilkin

LMS
TP
Clough/Magennis
Lance

RankPostsTeam
International Star27No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Apr 201213 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
May 2013Jun 2012LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Signing Lance Hohaia was a huge mistake. I just didn't see the sense in it. It reminds me of when we signed Darrell Trindall.

I'll say it one last time cos I'm bleating on. If we don't sign a scrum half for next season then it'll be the same again.

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach2928No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Feb 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Dec 2018Dec 2018LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Our main failing in tge halves is a lack of kicking game, hohaias kicking is poor, wellens is non existent. Moving him to the halfs makes the kicking problem worse, not better.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach10399No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200519 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2016Jul 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: FearTheVee "I'm not convinced we need to replace Wello at FB, he has lots of good points. We just need to tweak out predictable backs moves to involve him at an earlier point rather than at the strike end.
'"

You may be right.

If you go back to the Leeds game. Have a look at the try Wheeler scores. At that point, Roby had gone of, Lance was at hooker and Wilkin (now at #6) throws the killer pass. It was slick as an oil spill.
Why can't we recreate that sort of thing more often?
Quote: FearTheVee " a choice between Clough/Magennis on the bench '"
Not a hard choice for me. I reckon Clough's been one of our best performers over that last few weeks and I'm yet to see a game wheree Magennis has impressed me as a physical presence in the pack.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach16170No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200816 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Feb 2016Oct 2015LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: FearTheVee "I'm still of the opinion that playing Lance as an impact hooker is where we'll get the most out of him, with Robes moving to LF whilst he's on the pitch (or even getting a well earned rest, heaven forbid!)'"

That's what Simmons was doing with Scott Moore and Robes last year wasn't he?

RankPostsTeam
International Board Member14094
JoinedServiceReputation
Aug 200222 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Dec 2019Jul 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: SaintsFan "Lomax has played no.6 throughout his rugby career. Rush has been quoted as saying that all his coaches have stated he has been their best player within his cohort.

Lomax is definitely a halfback but which one? Simmons was quoted last season as saying he wasn't ready for international honours but hey-ho he was promoted from the Knights to the England team anyway. He hasn't yet had a full season in the scrum half jersey and I would like to know what Longy was like after less than a season in that position? My guess is he wasn't setting the world alight.

Lomax needs continued coaching, he needs support, he needs time and he needs an experienced halfback partner who is actually going to help him rather than hinder him.'"


This post is full of common sense.

RankPostsTeam
International Chairman27757No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jan 2021May 2018LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: FearTheVee "I'm not convinced we need to replace Wello at FB'"


Seriously? Wello is really only useful coming into the line when we're about ten to twenty metres out because the opposition knows that they can focus on his outside runners due to the lack of pace he has. Compare him to somebody with pace and look how indecisive a defence is when faced with the threat of a full back who, if you give them a yard, is gone through the gap. A fast, attacking full back has been a necessity at the very top of RL since Anthony Minichiello won the golden boot which was over seven years ago. I don't know of any NRL teams which could operate without one now. Seven years ago that wasn't a major issue because those other qualities were strong enough to compensate for any pace differentials, now they are not.

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach7498
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2023Feb 2018LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: McClennan "Seriously? Wello is really only useful coming into the line when we're about ten to twenty metres out because the opposition knows that they can focus on his outside runners due to the lack of pace he has. Compare him to somebody with pace and look how indecisive a defence is when faced with the threat of a full back who, if you give them a yard, is gone through the gap. A fast, attacking full back has been a necessity at the very top of RL since Anthony Minichiello won the golden boot which was over seven years ago. I don't know of any NRL teams which could operate without one now. Seven years ago that wasn't a major issue because those other qualities were strong enough to compensate for any pace differentials, now they are not.'"


a014.gif eusa_clap.gif eusa_clap.gif

eusa_clap.gif Spot on

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach7498
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2023Feb 2018LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: SaintsFan ". He hasn't yet had a full season in the scrum half jersey and I would like to know what Longy was like after less than a season in that position? My guess is he wasn't setting the world alight.

Lomax needs continued coaching, he needs support, he needs time and he needs an experienced halfback partner who is actually going to help him rather than hinder him.'"


Sean Long was a 6 when we bought him but we converted him to play 7 when Goulding left and Tommy Martyn came back from one of his many injuries. As you say he benefited from having an experienced half with him and also from having KC at 9 and players like Scully and Karl Hammond in the team.

Lomax needs coaching and he could do with a half with experience to partner him not some half d wannabe halfback who is better suited to fullback or hooker.

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach5355
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Apr 2023Apr 2023LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
TO BE FIXED



Quote: SaintsFan "

Lomax needs continued coaching, he needs support, he needs time and he needs an experienced halfback partner who is actually going to help him rather than hinder him.'"

I know a club where Jon could play and get all the things that you you list eusa_whistle.gif

148 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , BackrowSaint
148 posts in 11 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , BackrowSaint



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


3.62060546875:10
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
1m
Transfer Talk V5
Clearwing
522
5m
How many games will we win
Bullseye
49
9m
Shirt reveal coming soon
Shifty Cat
6
10m
Film game
karetaker
5770
12m
Game - Song Titles
Wildmoggy
40805
15m
BORED The Band Name Game
Wildmoggy
63271
20m
New Kit
Wires71
71
23m
Pre Season - 2025
Yippee try y
193
31m
Salford
rubber ducki
61
48m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Tarquin Fueg
4051
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
52s
Fixtures
Deadcowboys1
13
1m
Film game
karetaker
5770
1m
Salford
rubber ducki
61
1m
New Kit
Wires71
71
2m
Getting a new side to gel
Wigan Bull
2
2m
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
212
2m
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
NickyKiss
9
3m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
Trebor1
2612
5m
Fixtures 2025
Wigan Bull
10
5m
BORED The Band Name Game
Wildmoggy
63271
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Shirt reveal coming soon
Shifty Cat
6
TODAY
Opening Championship and League One Fixtures for 2025 Released
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Getting a new side to gel
Wigan Bull
2
TODAY
Fixtures
Deadcowboys1
13
TODAY
Writers required
H.G.S.A
1
TODAY
2025 Fixtures
Jemmo
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
POSTSONLINEREGISTRATIONSRECORD
19.65M +11,578 80,15614,103
LOGIN HERE
or REGISTER for more features!.

When you register you get access to the live match scores, live match chat and you can post in the discussions on the forums.
RLFANS Match Centre
 Thu 13th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Fri 14th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Hull KR
v
Castleford
20:00
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sat 15th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
St.Helens
v
Salford
       Championship 2025-R1
18:00
Toulouse
v
Widnes
 Sun 16th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Warrington
       Championship 2025-R1
15:00
Bradford
v
LondonB
15:00
Featherstone
v
Doncaster
15:00
Oldham
v
York
15:00
Sheffield
v
Halifax
15:00
Barrow
v
Hunslet
 Thu 20th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Wakefield
v
Hull KR
 Fri 21st Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Warrington
v
Catalans
20:00
Hull FC
v
Wigan
 Sat 22nd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
15:00
Salford
v
Leeds
20:00
Castleford
v
St.Helens
 Sun 23rd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
14:30
Leigh
v
Huddersfield
       League One 2025-R1
15:00
Cornwall
v
Workington
15:00
Dewsbury
v
Crusaders
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Hull KR
Sat 8th Mar
SL
17:30
Catalans-Leeds
Sun 9th Mar
SL
17:30
Warrington-Wakefield
SL
17:30
Wigan-Huddersfield
Thu 20th Mar
SL
20:00
Salford-Huddersfield
Fri 21st Mar
SL
20:00
St.Helens-Warrington
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
1m
Transfer Talk V5
Clearwing
522
5m
How many games will we win
Bullseye
49
9m
Shirt reveal coming soon
Shifty Cat
6
10m
Film game
karetaker
5770
12m
Game - Song Titles
Wildmoggy
40805
15m
BORED The Band Name Game
Wildmoggy
63271
20m
New Kit
Wires71
71
23m
Pre Season - 2025
Yippee try y
193
31m
Salford
rubber ducki
61
48m
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Tarquin Fueg
4051
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
52s
Fixtures
Deadcowboys1
13
1m
Film game
karetaker
5770
1m
Salford
rubber ducki
61
1m
New Kit
Wires71
71
2m
Getting a new side to gel
Wigan Bull
2
2m
2025 Recruitment
Pyrah123
212
2m
Salary Cap Changes Blocked - 11 votes to 1
NickyKiss
9
3m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
Trebor1
2612
5m
Fixtures 2025
Wigan Bull
10
5m
BORED The Band Name Game
Wildmoggy
63271
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Shirt reveal coming soon
Shifty Cat
6
TODAY
Opening Championship and League One Fixtures for 2025 Released
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Getting a new side to gel
Wigan Bull
2
TODAY
Fixtures
Deadcowboys1
13
TODAY
Writers required
H.G.S.A
1
TODAY
2025 Fixtures
Jemmo
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!