I think we really suffered for having such an inexperienced line up which was changed again. It took us the first half to work out who was playing where, only to have to do the same again in the second half when Atkins went off. We have no continuity from one game to the next, much less one season to the next. Apparently only four players from today played in the world cup - and that was only in 2008. How anyone can expect us to compete on that basis alone is surprising. However, I thought we did better than I'd anticipated but that was because of that purple patch in the second half. Hard to believe we actually beat the Kiwis in the second half.

Our defence, error rate, kicking game, follow up and commitment has to improve 100% if we are to stand a hope of avoiding a humiliating mullering at the hands of the Aussies next week.

I did like the BBC pre-match coverage though.

No disrespect to Wello who is still probably England's best full back but it proves that our backs are poor compared to the Aussies and Kiwis.

There are a number of players in the England Squad and especially those who played today should be nowhere near an International Side. Everybody was hailing Gareth Widdops performance against France but lets be quite honest France are no where near the standard of NZ and Australia and he was found out this morning. Ryan Atkins was very poor he offered very little in attack and was poor in defence. Kevin Brown is a very good Super League player but isnt International quality infact far from it. Darrell Griffin is just a steady Prop Forward who doesnt offer much really at all.

Our kicking game was absoultley dreadful. We lacked intensity in the first half and got shown up big time. There have to be changes to the team next week or at least a 100% improvement on line speed, tackling, kicking game, attacking play and aggression. If we dont Australia will give us a hammering next week and possibly overtake the 60dd points they scored against us back in 2002.

Sams the best english fullback, but if he has to be in the halves due to lack of other options then I'd have Wellens at FB. Least you know he can defend and catch a ball.

He is also has fantastic positional sense and is always there on the shoulder, waiting for the offload. All those aspects were missing from the fullback today. And he wasn't even much faster than Wello either!

I felt sorry for Widdop actually. He's had to step up to a far greater degree than the rest of the players given that he's only played in reserves matches so I suppose it's unfair to be too harsh on him. But McBanana has to keep him away from fullback from now on IMO for us to stand a chance.

I'd argue SpacNamara has to stay away from the England role for us to stand a chance...

Not a good performance. Very poor attacking wise and not much go forward.

Congratulations to the RFL for giving Mcnamara the job though, I mean, he's record speaks for itself doesn't it.........................Oh wait a minute.....

This is correct.

I know what you are saying but Sam is not an out and out full back compared to Wellens.
Personally I would play Sam at stand off,for me his true position.

The role of full back is changing though. Having a player with that attacking ability able to inject himself into the attacking line pretty much wherever he sees an opening can be, and as we found out in the GF has been, devastating.

I think his true position is quickly becoming fullback though. His positional sense is second to none and although he still lacks a physical presence, his technique for tackling bigger guys is second to none.

Being at FB allows him to attack from deep in space and basically pop up wherever and stop teams from trying to mark him out of the game. Plus he's not relied on as much to kick!

Nonesense. The role of the full back has always been that way, in the non too distant past, what type of player was Steve Prescott, what was his greatest strength? or Phil Veivers for that matter in his first few seasons at the club.

As for Wello, for a guy with a lack of speed, he was still our 2nd highest try scorer of the season in a season when we scored more tries than any other team. Oh and by far the best defensive FB in the League.

That mac the idiot picked a reserve grade player before him was/is a discgrace.

How many creative full backs have there been in SL in the last 10-15 years? I'm not saying there have never been creative fullbacks. However as defensive structures are becoming better and better the full back is becoming more of a focal point of attack.



Wellens has been shown to be not good enough at that level. If we'd had enough fit halves, I'm sure Tomkins would have been there.

I disagree about Tomkins' positional sense. Wello still pips him on that one, but it is improving. Likewise with his tackling. Again, Wello is still better than him at that. But Tomkins leaves Wello fumbling on the backline when it comes to pace and England looked a lot better with Tomkins at fullback. He was able to make up for the halves' lack of creativity from there and his drifting all over the pitch wasn't a distraction for the rest of the team from fullback as it was during the Maori friendly when he played in the halves. We looked structurally better in the second half against the Kiwis and that's the structure we need to go with against Australia even though we should replace a couple of the players.

oops