FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!
  
FORUMS > St. Helens > Mike Rush good or not....
52 posts in 4 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , Saint Simon , BackrowSaint
RankPostsTeam
International Star286No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2012Oct 2012LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg
:icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg



Did Mike Rush do a good job as our coach when Simmons was sacked?

RankPostsTeam
Club Owner29213No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200321 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Nov 2024Nov 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
6310_1310045241.jpg
:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_6310.jpg



He did a damage limitation job, but one which was never going to be enough to win us a trophy. He stabilised things nicely, but once he'd done that it was a mistake not bringing Brown in.

RankPostsTeam
International Star286No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2012Oct 2012LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg
:icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg



Quote: Saddened! "He did a damage limitation job, but one which was never going to be enough to win us a trophy. He stabilised things nicely, but once he'd done that it was a mistake not bringing Brown in.'"



It's not Rush's fault we didn't bring Brown in.

I find it shocking how saints fans can call Rush for the job he did.

RankPostsTeam
Administrator25122No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017May 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
7.gif
:7.gif



A mixed bag, really. On the one hand it is true to say he steadied the ship soon after our season looked like imploding completely. He pretty much sorted our defence and the pack functioned more than effectively. We ground out results against all of the big teams - including Wigan (albeit in the last match). Insofar as our attacking game is concerned he went back to plan A. It was solid, effective ... percentage football - which did the job without tearing up any trees. I don't hold the charge of conservative football against him as we aren't blessed with enormous amounts of skill or speed in the backs. But it would have been nice to see us open up a touch more.

I have two major problems with Rush. First was his complete mishandling of the playmaking roles. It now seems patently obvious that Lomax's success at scrum half the season prior was intrinsically linked to Gaskell and the tactical options he brings to the table. Without a playmaking stand-off Lomax consistently looked like a fish out of water. Indeed, there were times when I seriously thought Rush was [iharming[/i Lomax's game, which is a serious charge to level at any coach. This brings me neatly to my second problem with Rush - his personal qualities which, with the best of intentions I'm sure, appear to have disenfranchised many of our younger players - another serious charge, given that Rush is supposed to be an "expert" at working with kids. I think his handling of Lomax, Gaskell, Foster and Dixon has been poor and their form has flatlined completely under his charge. To me it looks like he's become far too close to the older, established players - many of whom have failed to perform (see Wilkin, Gardner etc.) and you could be forgiven for believing a "clique" of first team certainties has developed. In all my years watching Saints we have gone through many hard times - but one problem we've managed for the most part to dodge - a problem which has led to all manner of troubles at other clubs - is cliques. As long as I can remember St. Helens has been united club with great team spirit and camaraderie. For the first time in a long time I can't say the same this year.

RankPostsTeam
International Star1343No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201014 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2014Oct 2014LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
52961_1317652331.jpg
:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_52961.jpg



He did as good a job as he was capable of doing, but that was unfortunately not a very good job. I just hope the damage he's done to the careers of Lomax and Gaskell, as well as to the other young lads who've been denied any gametime under him, isn't permanent.

RankPostsTeam
International Star286No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2012Oct 2012LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg
:icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg



Quote: Northampton_Saint "He did as good a job as he was capable of doing, but that was unfortunately not a very good job. I just hope the damage he's done to the careers of Lomax and Gaskell, as well as to the other young lads who've been denied any gametime under him, isn't permanent.'"


What damage to lomax?

Lomax has suffered a case of second season syndrome.

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach16170No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jul 200816 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Feb 2016Oct 2015LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
40218_1286737075.jpg
Success is not final; failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts. (Winston Churchill):d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_40218.jpg



Quote: Ninja saint "Lomax has suffered a case of second season syndrome.'"

It would seem then that it's a mass outbreak because not one of the young players who did so well last year looked as good this year. Even Makinson has had moments this year that he simply didn't have last.

Second season syndrome exists only in the minds of Stevo and Eddie.

RankPostsTeam
Administrator25122No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017May 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
7.gif
:7.gif



Quote: Ninja saint "What damage to lomax?

Lomax has suffered a case of second season syndrome.'"


In his third (possibly fourth?) season?

RankPostsTeam
International Star286No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Sep 201113 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Oct 2012Oct 2012LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg
:icons3d44_files/4628-863FALH-msnicons.jpg



Quote: Mugwump "In his third (possibly fourth?) season?'"



As a scrum half mate.

RankPostsTeam
Administrator25122No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017May 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
7.gif
:7.gif



Quote: Ninja saint "As a scrum half mate.'"


Ah - so the undefined, undiagnosed disorder known as "Second Season Syndrome" now comes with additional qualifications meaning a player can be in his fourth, fifth - perhaps even his [iretirement[/i season and still fall victim? You know, a person could be forgiven for thinking you're making this up as you go along...

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach6767No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Oct 200717 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2024Apr 2024LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
Dwarfs, Gnomes, Halflings/GNOME2.JPG
The new young dynasty of super saints is coming to a ground near you. Welsby-Dodd-Simms-Eaves-Rizzelli, not Eastmond...the future is coming.:Dwarfs, Gnomes, Halflings/GNOME2.JPG



Quote: Saddened! "He did a damage limitation job, but one which was never going to be enough to win us a trophy. He stabilised things nicely, but once he'd done that it was a mistake not bringing Brown in.'"


Exactly, we were in a mess. Swopping and rotating players, only playing 3 players off the bench. Players not knowing what there game plans where, unable to create player partnerships over games.
All Rush did was get the mainstream experience players to take a look at themselves and get back into a team unit, this he did with some degree of success. The half back situation was the biggest problem, was he working to a set agenda and constraint, opportunities were given to Swift and Jones the latter being the positives this year. Makinson was looking as though he was on the same journey as Foster, but I remember he mentioned something in the press where they worked on his game resulting in much better performances over the last 2 to 3 months.
The only negative is Gaskell, will we ever know what was the thinkings and goings on with this player. As for Lomax feel sorry for the lad, he has been the one player with the most pressure to learn and perform he really needed an experienced head alongside him and Lance wasn't it.

RankPostsTeam
Administrator25122No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017May 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
7.gif
:7.gif



Playing 16 week after week didn't bother me that much. I thought it was a pretty bold plan based on at least [isome semblance of reasoning[/i (which is more than can be said of Rush's mishandling of the halfback roles!). Simmons genuinely thought his players were fit enough not to require the introduction of the final sub. I'm guessing he must have looked at the stats and seen some evidence to support this theory. Let's be perfectly honest here - SL is a very tough game and success is as much to do with managing finite resources (both physical and mental fitness) as anything else. If a team can manage with one less substitute (providing injuries on the day aren't too severe) and you aggregate the effect across the entire list of fixtures then, theoretically, you should begin the playoff system with a pretty substantial advantage over all those other sides who've been using their full compliment.

Unfortunately, Simmons never got to see his plan come to fruition but I can't help but wonder what effect it might have had come the playoffs.

RankPostsTeam
Club Coach2931No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
May 200520 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Sep 2024Mar 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
15252_1297730111.jpg
[color=#FF0000:dd3r80vu][b:dd3r80vu]I HATE ALL THE PIES[/b:dd3r80vu][/color:dd3r80vu]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_15252.jpg



Rush was a sticking plaster which worked better than expected but I think we got as far as we did because of a) the players and the effort they put in b0 the quality this year has not been as good as last year (yes I know Mugwump!).

I know of several young players who have played under Rush and did not enjoy the experiance; he concentrates on physical fitness and thats more or less it.

According to the Guardian "Rush, who is now expected to revert to chief executive at St Helens when Nathan Brown takes over as coach".
Revert?

RankPostsTeam
Administrator25122No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Dec 200123 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2017May 2017LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
7.gif
:7.gif



If Rush screws up the business end of the club will we be treated to a host of fans rallying to his defence claiming [i"He isn't a Chief Exec"?[/i

RankPostsTeam
Player Coach10399No
Team
Selected
JoinedServiceReputation
Jun 200519 years
OnlineLast PostLast Page
Jul 2016Jul 2016LINK
Milestone Posts
0
100
Milestone Years
0510 1520 2530
Location
Signature
16208_1345534518.jpg
[url=www.cater-bake.co.uk]Cater-Bake UK - Pizza and Bakery Equipment Specialists[/url]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_16208.jpg



Quote: Mugwump "A mixed bag, really. On the one hand it is true to say he steadied the ship soon after our season looked like imploding completely. He pretty much sorted our defence and the pack functioned more than effectively. We ground out results against all of the big teams - including Wigan (albeit in the last match). Insofar as our attacking game is concerned he went back to plan A. It was solid, effective ... percentage football - which did the job without tearing up any trees. I don't hold the charge of conservative football against him as we aren't blessed with enormous amounts of skill or speed in the backs. But it would have been nice to see us open up a touch more.

I have two major problems with Rush. First was his complete mishandling of the playmaking roles. It now seems patently obvious that Lomax's success at scrum half the season prior was intrinsically linked to Gaskell and the tactical options he brings to the table. Without a playmaking stand-off Lomax consistently looked like a fish out of water. Indeed, there were times when I seriously thought Rush was [iharming[/i Lomax's game, which is a serious charge to level at any coach. This brings me neatly to my second problem with Rush - his personal qualities which, with the best of intentions I'm sure, appear to have disenfranchised many of our younger players - another serious charge, given that Rush is supposed to be an "expert" at working with kids. I think his handling of Lomax, Gaskell, Foster and Dixon has been poor and their form has flatlined completely under his charge. To me it looks like he's become far too close to the older, established players - many of whom have failed to perform (see Wilkin, Gardner etc.) and you could be forgiven for believing a "clique" of first team certainties has developed. In all my years watching Saints we have gone through many hard times - but one problem we've managed for the most part to dodge - a problem which has led to all manner of troubles at other clubs - is cliques. As long as I can remember St. Helens has been united club with great team spirit and camaraderie. For the first time in a long time I can't say the same this year.'"
I have to heartily agree. For what ever reason we'd gone down a real hole with Royce. The defeats to Hull (home) and Bradford (away) were simply awful.
Rush steadied the ship and, for a lower tier coach, did ok - finishing 3rd in the table, beating Wire once in the playoffs and getting league results against all the big teams.
He got the pack going forward again, which given the personel, wasn't the most difficult task, but it still needed doing. He tactics in the backs however, were non existant.
Dropping Gaskell was definately part of it, but there was literally no play book out wide. If you think of last season, we were getting decent ball to Meli in the centre who was putting Foster in regulary for well worked tries. We weren't pulling up trees going forward, but were better then currently in terms of backs play.
Gaskell might not be alex murphy, but he's at least good enough to be given a run this year, even if it was alongside Hohaia rather than Lomax (which would have possible worked better than Lomax Hohaia).
When we played London a few weeks ago, i was interested to see how Wheeler would get on in the centre, but watching the game, I'm not sure if he was given the ball once running in his channel.

Thanks for filling in Mike, but I welcome our new coach with open arms and keen anticipation.

52 posts in 4 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , Saint Simon , BackrowSaint
52 posts in 4 pages 
<<   PREV  NEXT   >>
Subscribe | Moderators: Admin, Billinge_Lump , Saint Simon , BackrowSaint



All views expressed are those of the author and not necessarily those of the RLFANS.COM or its subsites.

Whilst every effort is made to ensure that news stories, articles and images are correct, we cannot be held responsible for errors. However, if you feel any material on this website is copyrighted or incorrect in any way please contact us using the link at the top of the page so we can remove it or negotiate copyright permission.

RLFANS.COM, the owners of this website, is not responsible for the content of its sub-sites or posts, please email the author of this sub-site or post if you feel you find an article offensive or of a choice nature that you disagree with.

Copyright 1999 - 2024 RLFANS.COM

You must be 18+ to gamble, for more information and for help with gambling issues see https://www.begambleaware.org/.



Please Support RLFANS.COM


3.9873046875:5
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
4m
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
16m
Film game
Boss Hog
5617
21m
Rumours thread
LyndsayGill
2514
33m
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
47m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63219
58m
2025 Recruitment
Rafa9
192
Recent
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
rugbyleague8
6
Recent
Fixtures
Willzay
13
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40727
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
24s
Pre Season - 2025
number 6
182
25s
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
47s
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Steve0
4009
50s
War of the Roses
karetaker
29
52s
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
4
56s
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
rugbyleague8
6
1m
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
1m
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
2m
Out of contract 2025
rubber ducki
62
2m
Leeds away first up
PopTart
39
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
REDWHITEANDB
2
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
4
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
rubber ducki
8
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
PopTart
39
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
The Biffs Ba
28
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Wollo-Wollo-
19
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
TODAY
England 5 - 0 Ireland
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To Newcastle
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
309
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
504
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1255
England's Women Demolish The W..
1079
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1318
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1108
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1364
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1910
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2128
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2372
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1945
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2179
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2646
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2074
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2152
POSTSONLINEREGISTRATIONSRECORD
19.65M +11,804 80,15514,103
LOGIN HERE
or REGISTER for more features!.

When you register you get access to the live match scores, live match chat and you can post in the discussions on the forums.
RLFANS Match Centre
 Thu 13th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Wigan
v
Leigh
 Fri 14th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
20:00
Hull KR
v
Castleford
20:00
Catalans
v
Hull FC
 Sat 15th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Leeds
v
Wakefield
17:30
St.Helens
v
Salford
 Sun 16th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R1
15:00
Huddersfield
v
Warrington
 Thu 20th Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Wakefield
v
Hull KR
 Fri 21st Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
20:00
Warrington
v
Catalans
20:00
Hull FC
v
Wigan
 Sat 22nd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
15:00
Salford
v
Leeds
20:00
Castleford
v
St.Helens
 Sun 23rd Feb 2025
     Mens Super League XXX-R2
14:30
Leigh
v
Huddersfield
ALL SCORES PROVIDED BY RLFANS.COM (SETTINGS)
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds-Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield-Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
4m
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
16m
Film game
Boss Hog
5617
21m
Rumours thread
LyndsayGill
2514
33m
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
47m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63219
58m
2025 Recruitment
Rafa9
192
Recent
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
rugbyleague8
6
Recent
Fixtures
Willzay
13
Recent
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40727
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
24s
Pre Season - 2025
number 6
182
25s
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
47s
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Steve0
4009
50s
War of the Roses
karetaker
29
52s
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
4
56s
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
rugbyleague8
6
1m
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
1m
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
2m
Out of contract 2025
rubber ducki
62
2m
Leeds away first up
PopTart
39
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Dan Norman Retires
Cokey
1
TODAY
How many games will we win
REDWHITEANDB
2
TODAY
Leigh Leopards - 2025 Fixtures
ColD
2
TODAY
Catalan Away
Dannyboywt1
4
TODAY
2025 Betfred Super League Fixtures
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
2025 fixtures
Smiffy27
15
TODAY
Fixtures
Willzay
13
TODAY
Salford
rubber ducki
8
TODAY
WCC Off
Choc Ice
11
TODAY
Leeds away first up
PopTart
39
TODAY
Jake McLoughlin
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Assistant Coach - Langley
The Biffs Ba
28
TODAY
Noah Booth out on loan
Wollo-Wollo-
19
TODAY
Luke Gale testimonial match
BarnsleyGull
2
TODAY
England 5 - 0 Ireland
Sadfish
1
TODAY
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To Newcastle
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
2025 Betfred Super League Fixt..
309
Magic Weekend 2025 - Back To N..
504
England Beat Samoa To Take Tes..
1255
England's Women Demolish The W..
1079
England Beat Samoa Comfortably..
1318
Operational Rules Tribunal –..
1108
IMG-RFL club gradings released..
1364
Wakefield Trinity Win Champion..
1910
Hunslet Secure Promotion After..
2128
Trinity Into Play Off Final Af..
2372
Wigan Warriors Crowned Champio..
1945
York Valkyrie Win Back to Back..
2179
Hunslet Book Relegation Play O..
2646
Penrith Panthers Secure Fourth..
2074
Wigan Humiliate Leigh For Gran..
2152


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!