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FORUMS > St. Helens > Wire stats (look at your peril) |
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| I see we had 12 breaks to warrington's 9, another terrible aspect of the game
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27476.gif I am the hash browns of rlfans :27476.gif |
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| Quote: bewareshadows "Just watched the game back on TV. I'm going to change tact on Wilkin he is as good as Flanagan in defense and runs far better attacking lines and does get an offload away.
I think the issue is consistency. I've never seen Flanagan turn up and not put in a shift. But Wilkin does seem to pick and chose games and I do wonder if he has a finger in too many pies with the Union and TV and RL.
He was very very good on Friday, yet when I had been at the game I missed most of the shift he put in. Where as flanagan's hard hits stood out. I think there is a difference in style, but in terms of effectiveness they are fairly equal defensively for me. Whether they are equal week by week is another matter.
But a back row of Wilkin, Flanagan and Wellens is just not viable for me.
If Wellens must play to give that heart and soul to a team. Then we have to face up that only one of Wilkin and Flanagan and maybe Jones can make the back row, in a fully fit team with Manu and Sia.
Amor Roby Walmsley Wilkin Manu Wellens
bench
Mose, Sia, Laffranchi, Greenwood or Walker.
This allows Wilkin to play the tackling stint for a full 80 but that role must be defined. Sia and Manu rotating on and off the field; with Mose and Laffranchi swaping with Amor and Walmsley.
In the end some fan favourites can't play together.
edit.....
if he gets game time Savelio may take that last bench spot. but that is also assuming a fully fit squad., chances of that happening ????????????/'"
Agree with a lot of what you say. My problem on the whole is the highlighted bit, either Wilkins role is poorly defined by the coaching team, or he simply drifts into trying to play other roles during the course of a game. Leave the kicking to Walsh and Hohaia (and in a pinch lomax) focus on playing a back row role, running lines and tackling then I'd be happy for him to play the spot he has. I just don't have faith in him not to try and float into getting involved in shift plays though, and would rather sacrifice the quality he has for the sake of someone who can fulfil that role.
On top of that, greenwood, Savelio, walker and Thompson are all pushing for regular time now (or in the case of Savelio, should be), and when Manu returns, does Wilkin, with his tendency to drift, deserve a spot ahead of them? He has talent no doubt, but playing wellens in the manner I suggested doesn't leave room for Wilkin to also play an unconventional role. I just don't think our pack is big enough to support 2 players playing untraditional roles, and given we have the youngsters waiting in the wings, it's a case of either or for me, rather than both.
I'd like to see:
Amor Roby Walmsley
Soliola Greenwood
Wellens/Wilkin
Laffranchi Masoe Manu(or Savelio) LMS/Wilkin/Wellens(to interchange at lock)
Plenty of options, and gives us flexibility throughout a game.
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44308_1279480467.gif Mugwump mocking mental illness for a second time -
"You are mentally ill and I can't indulge your madness any more"
Utter disgusting abusive remark from a keyboard warrior:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_44308.gif |
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| Quote: Magic Superbeetle "Agree with a lot of what you say. My problem on the whole is the highlighted bit, either Wilkins role is poorly defined by the coaching team, or he simply drifts into trying to play other roles during the course of a game. Leave the kicking to Walsh and Hohaia (and in a pinch lomax) focus on playing a back row role, running lines and tackling then I'd be happy for him to play the spot he has. I just don't have faith in him not to try and float into getting involved in shift plays though, and would rather sacrifice the quality he has for the sake of someone who can fulfil that role.
On top of that, greenwood, Savelio, walker and Thompson are all pushing for regular time now (or in the case of Savelio, should be), and when Manu returns, does Wilkin, with his tendency to drift, deserve a spot ahead of them? He has talent no doubt, but playing wellens in the manner I suggested doesn't leave room for Wilkin to also play an unconventional role. I just don't think our pack is big enough to support 2 players playing untraditional roles, and given we have the youngsters waiting in the wings, it's a case of either or for me, rather than both.
I'd like to see
We've missed Manu more than we expected, I'll be glad to see him back.
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| Quote: St pete "We've missed Manu more than we expected, I'll be glad to see him back.'"
We sure have missed him for his skill of getting the ball out of the tackle and providing that to unpredictability. Back to the Wilkin debate I would suggest fans on here study Wilkins play in depth over a couple of games to show how important he is to the pattern of our attacking options.
Its going to be very difficult for Brown when we are at full strength to know what his best team is going to be especially the bench players.
I don't see Flanagan in the back 3 at all, his strengths are his tackling and a good passer of the ball so in that respect he could be cover or rotation for Roby.
Of the 4 youngsters in Greenwood, Sav, Thompson, Walker I would have them in that pecking order with Greenwood the pick of the bunch.
When Lomax returns we are still going to have the problem of when, where and how we are going to play Wellens.
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27476.gif I am the hash browns of rlfans :27476.gif |
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| Quote: Judder Man "We sure have missed him for his skill of getting the ball out of the tackle and providing that to unpredictability. Back to the Wilkin debate I would suggest fans on here study Wilkins play in depth over a couple of games to show how important he is to the pattern of our attacking options.
Its going to be very difficult for Brown when we are at full strength to know what his best team is going to be especially the bench players.
I don't see Flanagan in the back 3 at all, his strengths are his tackling and a good passer of the ball so in that respect he could be cover or rotation for Roby.
Of the 4 youngsters in Greenwood, Sav, Thompson, Walker I would have them in that pecking order with Greenwood the pick of the bunch.
When Lomax returns we are still going to have the problem of when, where and how we are going to play Wellens.'"
I think your missing my point. I know that Wilkin contributes to our attacking structure, but that isn't the role of a second rower. If he was playing halfback, then it's great he's doing his job. Second rowers should be running lines off said creative players and cause confusion in defences - when he sticks to that he does very well, makes breaks and looks good. But, he doesn't stick to just that.
Greenwood is another who "runs good lines" so is comparable. He's no where near as accomplished as Wilkin yet (not saying he couldn't be in time) but his propensity to stick to the role he's given, not the kicking or the passing games means I'd take the decreased ability for the stability in our plays.
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44308_1279480467.gif Mugwump mocking mental illness for a second time -
"You are mentally ill and I can't indulge your madness any more"
Utter disgusting abusive remark from a keyboard warrior:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_44308.gif |
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| Quote: Magic Superbeetle "I think your missing my point. I know that Wilkin contributes to our attacking structure, but that isn't the role of a second rower. If he was playing halfback, then it's great he's doing his job. Second rowers should be running lines off said creative players and cause confusion in defences - when he sticks to that he does very well, makes breaks and looks good. But, he doesn't stick to just that.
Greenwood is another who "runs good lines" so is comparable. He's no where near as accomplished as Wilkin yet (not saying he couldn't be in time) but his propensity to stick to the role he's given, not the kicking or the passing games means I'd take the decreased ability for the stability in our plays.'"
Wilkin just isn't good enough.
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Wigan |
29 |
768 |
338 |
430 |
48 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Hull KR |
29 |
731 |
344 |
387 |
44 |
Warrington |
29 |
769 |
351 |
418 |
42 |
Leigh |
29 |
580 |
442 |
138 |
33 |
Salford |
28 |
556 |
561 |
-5 |
32 |
St.Helens |
28 |
618 |
411 |
207 |
30 |
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Catalans |
27 |
475 |
427 |
48 |
30 |
Leeds |
27 |
530 |
488 |
42 |
28 |
Huddersfield |
27 |
468 |
658 |
-190 |
20 |
Castleford |
27 |
425 |
735 |
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15 |
Hull FC |
27 |
328 |
894 |
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6 |
LondonB |
27 |
317 |
916 |
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27 |
1032 |
275 |
757 |
52 |
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
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26 |
765 |
388 |
377 |
37 |
Bradford |
28 |
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420 |
303 |
36 |
York |
29 |
695 |
501 |
194 |
32 |
Widnes |
27 |
561 |
502 |
59 |
29 |
Featherstone |
27 |
634 |
525 |
109 |
28 |
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Sheffield |
26 |
626 |
526 |
100 |
28 |
Doncaster |
26 |
498 |
619 |
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25 |
Halifax |
26 |
509 |
650 |
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Batley |
26 |
422 |
591 |
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Swinton |
28 |
484 |
676 |
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20 |
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25 |
442 |
720 |
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437 |
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18 |
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27 |
348 |
879 |
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4 |
Hunslet |
1 |
6 |
10 |
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0 |
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