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Club Coach | 743 | St. Helens |
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| Quote bewareshadows="bewareshadows"Fans will always move before anyone else.
Fans will sign players up to 4 year contracts off the back of 4 games, they will sack players off the back of one game and will hale coaches and deride them withiin the space of a sentence.
Fans have no need to account for anything other than their own emotions, but I doubt we will sack a coach mid-season based on reults alone, unless those results start to infere an irreversable set of fortunes.
I know saddened has asked how bad does it have to get as we have not won in 4 games. That's the lack of perspective a fan has. 4 games without a win = end of the world. For those running a club, you have to allow for periods without a win. It's not about the run of form, but the distance from an end of season unacceptable result.
So I would imagine for the board a sacking would be an inability to make the top 8, this would take to about 2/3rds of the season to find out. Hence in a final year Royce ain't going to get sacked. There is a difference between an unacceptable result and a sacking result. I imagine the board would find falling outside the top 4 unacceptable, I think in terms of getting a new contract. Royce would need top 4 and a trophy of some description.
So you can look at it in many different ways, but to sack Royce would require more than just unacceptable form over a short period of time.
A good example is the first 6 games in 2007, we had 3 losses out of 6. But DA was not sacked, he was given time to change it around and we finished top 2, with the CC.'"
Excellent post and as I posted above, I completely agree.
This may be a crude analogy given that it's a different sport but as we speak Spurs are losing 1 - 0 at Everton. If they get beat they will have lost 3 games on the trot and they have been dire so far. Will they sack Harry Redknapp?
Saints should never become a sacking Club. If we do we'll never even stand a chance of attracting a top coach.
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Player Coach | 16963 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Allez="Allez"The Chairman will only act if [uhe[/u thinks he's poor or that there's a number of performances or trend that affect the commercial viability of the business. Not based on emotional or knee jerk reactions. Player power is a disease - look at Chelsea and I very much doubt he wouldn't take other factors into consideration.
I know one of the players very very well and trust him as a discerningly honest individual and I've been told things I would never repeat to anyone. If the players think he is poor then that's not something I have ever been told - as I suspect that's what you are inferring.'"
I'm also very good friends with people at the club and my best mate is at the club and my opinion is he's not the greatest coach. (that's my opinion and not anyone I know at saints)
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International Chairman | 4096 | Doncaster RLFC |
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| It may only be four disastrous performances but Potter wasn't given that long before the "your fired" finger was twitching under the desk.
I think I speak for most Saints fans, we aren't like the Wigoon fans of the 80's & 90's who almost expected success, we have tasted the bridesmaid tag enough to know that you savour every cup you win, and we have done that many times since 1996. BUT for saints fans it's more than that, we expect the team to play in a manner that is both successful and entertaining. If we lose in a GF to a better team, and play well, you'll get no complaint from me, but it seems like the team have descended into mediocre and that is bad for business in the long term. For Eamon, it's about ensuring those season ticjet holders turn up with their cash to renew next season to keep the club on a sound footing.
Even in this very harsh financial climate, with job losses and increased living costs, the fans have kept their end of the bargain, turning up and paying their money to show their support for what Eamon has done. Two of the three jigsaw pieces are in place but the club is going to need the team producing the goods to keep the fans paying their money.
It's not just about winning, it's the manner of the performances that are the most concerning. Last night, Lance got caught with no runners on three or four occasions. You had both half backs taking the line on from first receiver with no option runners whatsoever. You had Gaskell hitting lead runners on the last tackle (Dixon caught with the ball), plus Wheeler ran it himself on the last too and got caught.
The issue for Saints is that they have based their style of play around a quick PTB and short passes around the ruck. As soon as a referee allows a team to slow Saints PTB by just 1 or 2 seconds (as Hull did last night), then we don't seem to have a plan B.
We don't seem to be capable of attacking with any flair for the most part. All tries are tries but the majority of ours, against the better defensive teams, are from within 20m of the opposition line. We haven't got a Darren Albert who can score from 90m out. When Meli put JF through a hole on the 40, he panicked and put in a pointless kick that was made far too early (McKinnon had it well covered) which indicates to me a massive confidence issue. Im pretty sure it was third tackle too so could have tried to beat the full back and work off the back if the break/field position.
I've already mentioned Wellos lack of a pass with the 3 on 1 in the corner and his compounded error in dropping Perrys offload, which ended up costing us 6 points and gifting a further 6 to Hull.
Now I'm sure the players don't do these things on purpose but it does seem to indicate a little more than just a minor dip in form.
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Club Coach | 743 | St. Helens |
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| Quote St pete="St pete"I'm also very good friends with people at the club and my best mate is at the club and my opinion is he's not the greatest coach. (that's my opinion and not anyone I know at saints)'"
And I don't disagree with your assessment of him one bit - I have held that view since the day we appointed him knowing the reputation (or lack thereof) he has as a coach in Australia. However, sacking him now would cause more problems than it solves unless there's an absolute top class coach with a pedigree available. As far as I am aware there isn't. I don't think Eamonn will get caught up in the fans hysteria because we have lost 3 games.
Anyway, onwards and upwards. Am looking forward to next week.
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International Board Member | 29216 | No Team Selected |
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| Sack him and hire Sean Long with Daniel Anderson as 'Director of Rugby with a free pass to visit Australia whenever he chooses'.
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| Quote Allez="Allez"And I don't disagree with your assessment of him one bit - I have held that view since the day we appointed him knowing the reputation (or lack thereof) he has as a coach in Australia. However, sacking him now would cause more problems than it solves unless there's an absolute top class coach with a pedigree available. As far as I am aware there isn't. I don't think Eamonn will get caught up in the fans hysteria because we have lost 3 games.
Anyway, onwards and upwards. Am looking forward to next week.'"
If I was a chairman I'd obviously look at what's available now or at the end of the season.
I'd love DA to take charge, even if it was only to the end of the season. We need some to get the squad organised.
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| Quote Saddened!="Saddened!"Sack him and hire Sean Long with Daniel Anderson as 'Director of Rugby with a free pass to visit Australia whenever he chooses'.'"
Never mind long coaching, get him playing!
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| Quote The Chief="The Chief"All tries are tries but the majority of ours, against the better defensive teams, are from within 20m of the opposition line. '"
I've learned from Phil Clarke, that bastion of statistics, that in fact most tries per se are scored from within the 20m opposition line.
However, I do agree with what you said in the rest of your post. The team is making way too many errors, some of quite an alarming type, for the problem simply to be a form thing. We have relied upon James Roby too much which is understandable to a degree with two young halves last year but this year that needs to change in case we find ourselves without him at the business end and fighting for a spot in the eight.
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Player Coach | 20628 | Oldham |
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| People always tell me about these cycles in sport, the ones in which a team that is used to winning everything suddenly fall down the ladder and look back on their past greatness, Bradford won the league in 2005.
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| Quote SaintsFan="SaintsFan"I've learned from Phil Clarke, that bastion of statistics, that in fact most tries per se are scored from within the 20m opposition line.
However, I do agree with what you said in the rest of your post. The team is making way too many errors, some of quite an alarming type, for the problem simply to be a form thing. We have relied upon James Roby too much which is understandable to a degree with two young halves last year but this year that needs to change in case we find ourselves without him at the business end and fighting for a spot in the eight.'"
I think it all comes to the fact we need a good halfback and the idea of playing lance there has failed as many predicted.
Also, we need to good hard working meter making prop.
I honestly think if we had signed a top scrum half and top prop we would have won all our games so far this year.
That isn't having a pop at laffranchci or lomax as both are really trying but its just not worked and Royce should hold his hand up and say he's messed up.
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