Shenton and LMS, I will give us time with them 2, but Wilkin

I think Wilkin really puts in the effort for you lot, he's a dirty git, but he puts a lot into his game from what I can see.

Flannery?

He wasn't technically out. He is just so average they forgot about him and left him at the services on the way down by mistake.

Wilkin

With a fully fit perry/Pryce/flannery/wellens it would have been diffrent.

Well, they managed to draw (and nearly beat) the best team in the league, so I don't know how anyone could come to that conclusion. Neither team played particularly well, but if someone offered me that result before the game I would have have taken it in a flash considering that we played an inexperienced half-back combination just back from repetitive injuries.

I would give it time (and some defeats) before smashing the players to bits.

Utter cr@p is a bit strong but for most of the game it did look like we were incapable of putting a decent attacking move together, never mind scoring a try.

Having said that, I think we have a solid side would have beaten most Super League teams today. That's not going to get the silverware though. We need the quality to unlock the defences of our nearest rivals in the big games.

Wigan were the same as the entire of last season, immense out of the blocks, 4 man tackles and big runs forward, by 60 mins though they're knackered, but theryre usually 30 points up by then so it doesn't matter, keep them within 20 points and you can beat them in the second half

Yup. It's going to take a while for Simmons to undo all the bad work there. However, unlike Potter's Saints, this Saints didn't give away a match in the last 20; they came a goal kick away from winning it. Ha! We were actually fitter than The Champions! And more composed (unlike Potter's Saints). And we didn't leak more than 20 points! (Didn't manage to score more either, which is like Potter's Saints)

Things are going to take time but IMO there was plenty in that match from which to take encouragement.

Just seeing the faces of the Pies in Cardiff was enough!

I've never been a big fan of either Roby or Wilkin, but I thought they were two of your best players last night.