I think everyone can agree on that. But even that could be managed if we had viable replacements lined up and the ancients only played if they earned a spot. If our 'alternatives' include giving Liam Sutcliffe a crack at yet another position or keeping Walters around then we'll be back here next year having the same discussion.

Add to that Ferres - who quite frankly isn't worth a shirt and that along with Ward will fill your back row and two of your subs places.

Happy days - we don't have any youngsters to give them competition for places - the youth development at Leeds is at an all time low.

What's gone wrong with the youth system? Why is so little talent coming through?

Ask McDermott - he was in charge of this demise

Far too simplistic.

You cannot expect the development section each year to produce a full pack worthy of a top SL side. We have Oledski and Smith who should make the grade and there are others perhaps ready in another year.

You cannot just ignore the number of regular long term injuries that have weakened the squad. Ferres has never been fit since we signed him yet came with an international reputation. Galloway's injury caused him to retire yet he was not replaced. Peteru looks a good signing but has been injured for most of the season as has Garbutt. Ward who came through the juniors has missed 10 matches with injury as has Delaney but both put in the effort when on the field.

Cuthbertson has had to be used as a workhorse and so has lost some of his attacking sparkle and together with Singleton, JJB and Ablett have had to do the heavy lifting for the first half of the season when all the big men were out.

Yes we should have been making quality signings to keep the side balanced but knee and facial injuries cannot be put down to age.

If Sinfield had been in charge of the team for all of this season given the same injury crisis then there is no guarantee we would have performed any better

no. but ones a rookie and ones a multi cup winning experienced head coach. he should have done better this year. by better I mean mid table.

The point wasn't about the team's performance - it was about the demise of the junior development.

Injuries are irrelevant in respect of the junior to senior pipeline either you have the players coming through to challenge the senior players or you don't. As head of coaching McDermott was responsible for the structure and the pipeline.

Love JJB and i would like to see him stay around the club in some capacity but its time to let go as a player imo. Delaney too.

I agree. sheer madness to re-sign them

All 3 need to call it a day and thank the club for giving them a glorious career.

Ablett will be still here next season but I’ll be surprised if Delaney and JJB are still around.

surely JJB's future is secured in a media career why does he want to carry on ?

I believe another year for JJB would mean a second testimonial - probably a good reason for him to want to fight on 1 more year.

A very sad reflection on the club and its aspirations if they are still interested in signing a player who made his debut 20 years ago. It is also pretty selfish on JJB who must know he is not the player he was and who contributes so little on the field to negatively impact the team for his own benefit

I’m all for no-one is bigger than the club but it’s not on them to call it a day and the club didn’t “give” them a glorious career.
It’s up to the club to say sorry we can’t find a space for you here as a player anymore and all those 3 players have worked incredibly hard for their careers and gone through sacrifices and physical and mental barriers the likes of us never have to in our jobs.
They’ve benefitted from the club being well run and being successful, but they’ve helped forge that success and the club has benefitted just as much from them as they have from the club.

Both should respect each other but neither should feel beholden to the other.