Thought is was a try also. The ball carrying arm can hit the deck before you score - examples all the time of players sliding over under their own momentum or that of a tackler while being tackled to score tries. Tackle was in process and McGuire's momentum (aided by the tackler) carried him over.

Unless Tansey is freakishly strong and propelled McGuire over the line while lying on the ground, there was an awful lot of McGuire effort in that movement. He certainly picked up some of that "momentum" after he had rolled over. In my house we obey the laws of thermodynamics. Second effort. No try.

I think there is no arguing with this, but it does highlight a point.

I have no idea who was at the ground or not at the ground, but I do think TV gives a completely different view to actual match.

At the game, as Soprano said, every time Delaney was in something he was bent over and hands on knees. He wasn't running as often as he normally does. And to be fair in his second spell when Cas were on their feet and he had a rest, two runs were each 15/20 metres a piece. So adjusting for those two the previous 8 carries would have being something like 5 metres per carry. On top of this you really didn't notice him in the tackle as often as his stats show.

However, all that said, the stats don't lie I presume, they display an incredible effort.

On the contrary Delaney has OFTEN put in a MoM performance because of what he brings to the table. I have never expected him to produce something spectacular ( is that how you judge every MoM contender? ).
I for one do not 'undervalue' him and I am generally a big fan of his exactly because of his workload. If anyone is going to potentially fill Peacock's boots at prop then it is he.
I simply stated at the moment he "looks" jaded and not at his best. If the statistics show otherwise then I hold my hand up and would need to look again. His workload normally stands out for me and maybe it is more of an indication that all of the forwards are getting 'stuck in'.
I am a big Delaney fan, but it is maybe time to give him a relatively easier game for a few matches from the bench. I am also keen to see how Stevie Ward goes with an extended run at LF in the same way McDermott is very successfully easing Sutcliffe into the responsibilities at SO.

You made your comment after seeing the stats too and admitted that your opinion at the match was wrong. I thought during the game that Delaney was putting in a real big effort and it was that big effort that made him look understandably tired. He may have looked poor to you but that opinion has been proved to be a wrong one. If anyone didn't look fit it was Bailey.

As Watkins said BJB had a real good game. If you want to be critical of handling mistake in difficult conditions then you would start with the 3 that Hardaker made followed by the 2 that Briscoe made in addition to slack marking for the Dixon try. BJB made zero handling errors and recovered the high kick at the second attempt. He was also on hand with good anticipation and positioning on several other occassions and took his turn in taking the ball in.

Well your first paragraph is irrelevant when you read your second one. Because if you think BJB did not make any handling errors then you clearly did not watch the match.

There is a difference between errors and knock-ons.

I agree Briscoe had a relative 'mare' but he never seems to play well on the left on the occasions he has being selected there... As I stated elsewhere that is puzzling since he spent most of his Hull career there. BJB may have earned his place on the right for the magic weekend, but the thing is for me (perhaps unfairly) he never instils confidence in any defensive situation and gives me the jitters. He is also pretty feeble at taking the ball in which is a real contrast to Hall and Briscoe when fighting back upfield.

I am usually in the TV camp these days (distance plus toddler care). You do get a different view (I was at every game for many years). Some incidents you see more clearly on TV, but a lot of stuff about the shape of the game and things in back-play and around the fringes are lost. I read these forums to fill that in.

With regard to Delaney's early carries, I noticed (partly because I was looking for it given some previous threads) that in the early exchanges he was mainly carrying the ball into the thick of heavy traffic. Exept for JP, who carries just about everywhere and is Superman, it's noticeable this year that this is a job done mainly by the backs for a couple of tackles and then largely by Kylie and Delaney. It's a danger, IMO, of the stats in that they don't take account of the places and situations those yards are made. Kylie probably never makes big yards, but he always makes hard yards, which means some of the quicker players don't have to thud the ball into 4 tacklers up the middle.

Tackle-wise, I do think you get a better idea on TV (because of the benefits of zoom) who is doing what in 2 or 3 man tackles. Delaney becomes very noticeable then. He's also very dynamic after contact, driving people back, wrestling them onto their backs. That's all seriously anaerobic stuff and it's little wonder he's slow to get to his feet on occasions.

Incredible effort is what he's all about.

We can only state our opinions and mine are quite different that yours it would seem. I rate Delaney, BJB and our coach (including their contributions last night)

I also rate them, and yes including the coach this year which I have admitted. I just comment on what I see at the time.

Everything does. That's why they are called "laws" and not "guidelines".

I think it's how the people who award MoM at grounds and on telly tend to judge every MoM. I'm not usually entitled to make the award.

You may not undervalue him (don't think I was directing that at anyone in particular) but a few threads I've read recently seem to suggest that people don't notice a lot of the type of work he does. This is a pretty common phenomenon with players of this kind. His workrate did stand out for me last night, although as I said this could be because I was looking for it.

I'm not sure how easy a game you can give him. If he's on the pitch, I think he'll go looking for work.

I agree that I'd like to see Stevie Ward play at 13 for a few games. Maybe not at the same time as easing Sutcliffe into the 6 role though? Given the tough fixtures coming up.

Was it the offside from McGuires kick early in the second half?, very unlucky if it was

That was a play the ball given, as set completed.

In answer to tvoc, I thought at the game Cas got three penalties and us two last night, so was surprised when saw four this morning to Cas. Reckon they have made up the Singleton one for the incident stated above.