No, and I have not said that either. I am stating this squad haven't won an important match without Sinfield, and therefore this "know how to win finals" is over optimistic. More relevant would be that Leeds have been incredibly lucky this year, and if that continues I would be more optimistic on that basis.

What we should all be saying is that we are poop, when we win a match, we are lucky and the coach has had help from someone else (a favourite of mine).....Cas have been excellent this year and deserve all the plaudits, Leeds have exceeded all expectations and may have a chance of getting to another GF. With ground improvements and a shot at OT, I'd rate this season as pretty good. The overall standard of SL has been poor in comparison to years gone by, but watching a game is still enjoyable for me. I don't need to see my team win to enjoy a game, I go to Halifax, Bradford, Dewsbury, Batley and Oldham during the season as well as Siddall and enjoy every game. Pity some folk.

Well in your mind Sinfield might've won those GF's single handledly but others will rightly recognised the key performances from others.

Most would also recognise the platform Sinfield created for those players to perform

I don't see how you get that impression from that post?
Those key performances whilst rightly lauded & recognised all came off the back of quality efforts across the 17 but what should never be over looked or underplayed was the Leadership & sheer presence of Sinfield & JP.
This current crop have no default setting of winning big games without either.

No but their GF experience doesn't just disappear out of window to be dismissed because Sinfield and Peacock have retired.

Wakey blew it late on which keeps Saints alive and puts us closer to securing 2nd as only Hull can catch us now. A Hull loss to Wigan tomorrow and doesn't matter what happens with our result.

Scott Grix really needs to learn when to boot a ball into row Z, you'd have thought he'd have learnt from the Ryan Hall try at Hudds.

Wakefield blew it all through the second half - accepting for ten mins they were down a man - but negatively kicking the ball off the field didn't challenge St Helens in those conditions. Barba didn't fancy those bombs in traffic.

Surprised wakey kicked that last penalty goal. Thought they would have been smarter to kick into the saints corner and pin them down that end of the field. The importance of gamemanagement which is being discussed on this thread . Sinfield, McGuire etc etc.

Printer - I don't think Leeds need to beat Cas necessarily, but they need to get close enough to believe they can beat them. Relying on a team who have collectively shown nothing in important games for almost two full seasons to come alive on GF day with some air of completely undeserved superiority just doesn't wash. If we did that I reckon our 'confidence' due to the past would be a wafer-thin veneer and would disappear very quickly under pressure.

What are people classifying as important games in the last two years?

Huddersfield CC
Widnes at home to avoid dropping into the bottom 4
Hull CC

All of which the team failed to deliver any kind of performance let alone a win

You may well be correct in that if they get to the GFthe team will suddenly morph into Leeds c2015 - I would suggest the chances are more against than for that happening.

You may not lose the experience but you cannot turn back father time and the likes of McGuire, Burrow, Ablett, JJB are not anywhere near the players they once were and the likes of Peacock and Kylie simply haven't been replaced with anything approaching their quality and that is before you talk about the Sinfield factor.

burrow and McGuire have been match winners in grand finals, but they never have controlled a game. the semi v hull was a game crying out for a controlling half. when hull got on top we should continually kicked deep into touch,stopped their momentum and got back into the game. we played into there hands with naive plays.both great players but not a controlling half. lilley likely is the only one who can. be really interesting to see how he goes tonight

That game last night told it all for me. Two teams, so important for the win for where they need to be. Yet the intensity level in the game never even reached a level as high as zero. Such a poor poor competition this year.

Sinfield would have successfully kicked the goal then recovered the short kick off waltzed leeds down field and kicked drop goal . Kicking the pen from 4 6 wasn't the big failing for Trinity last night. Finn hitting the post with it then the mess on the back of the Saints kick is what cost them