It's pointless having a 6 & 7 who are basically from the same "mould" in that they are both runners and neither controls a game or has a good enough kicking game.
Williams is a potentially a cracking 6 but he still needs guidance and a 7 that as described above he got neither from Widdop who was forced into running sideways going nowhere RL with a poor kicking game.
As many have mentioned Mcbanana is the problem Farrell did naff all but seems un-subable Bateman is not and never will be an international centre again something which isn't his fault.
It was clueless plodding 1 up RL and the atmosphere at the stadium matched the weather for the 3rd test i'd go with..
Hardaker
Burgess
Watkins
Cudjo(purely because the numpty didn't pick Shenton)
Hall
Widdop
Gale
T.Burgess
Roby
Graham
Ferres
Bateman
O'Lochlin

Hill
Hodgeson
Cooper
Westwood

Widdop simply isn't that good. His running isn't straight enough, he doesn't commit defenders at all, and he doesn't have a killer pass. I was a big fan of his but since he's gone to the Dragons he's been virtually anonymous as an attacking threat.

I do agree that england need a change in mindset - they need to think in terms of moving the ball around. That's when we look dangerous.

what is frustrating is that we have a monster front row, and an adequate second row. We have some excellent backs too. We just can't get the ball to them despite being on the front foot. A change in the halves is needed IMO

The halves are getting a lot of stick, some but not all justified.

Our kicking game was awful. In those conditions we needed a long accurate kicks to gain territory.

The halves were woeful, but then there we very rarely had an option for them apart from a short ball to the forwards. I can count on one hand the times we looked set up properly to shift the ball out wide.

It's difficult for any half to play people into gaps when there are just no options available.

Our forwards certainly put the hard work input there was very little fire, or variety, quick ptb's , offloads. At no out in the game did anyone put any doubt into the kiwis minds.

It's easy to criticise individuals but the main reasons in my mind were;

A) very poor conservative game plan - I've supported McNamara before but he just got this wrong. Why pick a superb attacking winger when we only want our wingers to act as a forward. Even Shaun wane who loves his wingers driving the ball in, knows they are also potent attacking threats.

B) very poor long kicking game

C) far too much energy taken up defending our line in the first half. I really think this took out a huge amount and impacted the energy they put into creating attacking options

D) selection. Get the above 3 points sorted and we could have easily won that with the players on the pitch. But;

Why pick Bateman at centre when we have decent centres . Again it goes back to the awful plan by McNamara of making us hard to beat and not going to win the game. We have one of the best centres in Watkins and he's hardly got a pass.

Why pick williams, promising as he is but obviously not experienced at this level.

Why play Roby as the impact hooker slot?

I have feeling we trained with having Sam Tomkins in mind and when he failed his fitness we threw a last minute team and plan together.

You thought we were on the front foot on Saturday? Not sure what the meterage was, but we seemed to spend most of the time within our 40.

I thought the forwards looked slow, and tired on Saturday. They definitely weren't as effective as they were in the first game. Having no back rowers with any go forward isn't helping to reduce the work load of the bigger lads in the middle, though.

Everything points to the Coach not knowing what he is doing!

A failed SL Coach and Assistant Coach in the NRL shouldn't be our National Coach!

I think we should be looking towards Brian Mac, Shaun Wane and Anderson as a Coaching Team. Brian Mac as Head Coach and the others as Assistant Coaches.

That would be interesting.I'm sure Wane and Anderson would be willing to take orders from general Mac

I thought Tom Burgess played a huge part in changing the momentum of the first test and Ryan Hall had a huge impact too in that game returning the ball.Both were given extra attention on Saturday and we never found that true go forward at all, although we did burn a lot of energy in that first period by giving NZ countless sets on our own line which certainly didn't help the cause.

I thought when we had the ball we made good meters and got quick play the balls. We defended lots of sets on our own line but most of those started in our half.

The point being that the forwards (although not as strong as the first test) certainly gave enough of a platform for us to exploit

"Too many cooks spoil the broth" springs to mind.

To me it looked like they were playing a territorial game, march down the field with low risk, hard running forward drives and take any metres on offer from dummy half. The forward drives were sometimes effective at gaining metres but they were very predictable, and ultimately one out rugby is extremely easy to defend against. Even Roby didn't looke like he knew what he was doing at times, to make a player with his class look so lost is a real accomplishment. You have to, at some point actually attack. No short side moves, nothing resembling a decent attacking kick, no width or depth on attack when we did spread it. Did we move the ball once in our own half?
We scored from 2 yards out with a forward crashing over in the first test and it seemed like all we were trying to do was set up for that again to the exclusion of everything else. The fact that a lot of very experienced players were incapable of making the on-field changes required to challenge the Kiwis more with the ball is very disappointing.
The halves were poor, but all they seemed tasked with was turning the ball inside or one pop to a forward. Did any of our forwards actually offload at all? It was up the jumper, head down and in. I've rarely seen a game where James Graham - who's trademark is the pop pass before contact - didn't have options running alongside him but Saturday it was if he was told not to pass so nobody was with him. We put no doubt in the defenders minds and if you don't the halves get slow ball with an advancing defence.

I also don't believe in selecting the same team just because you won the week before. Anyone being honest would say that things did not fire well in the first test and we had a two huge slices of luck in the first half with the kiwi third try being chalked off and the jammy bounce 60 seconds later for our first try. The other way around and the Kiwis were out of sight in that game (the penalty count second half hid the true awfulness of our kicking game).

I would also say that this is the most unhappy looking bunch of players I've seen in an England shirt for a very long time.

I noticed how narrow the Kiwi defence was in our half. A couple of quick long passes out wide would have got round their fringe. We didn't even think to try that.

Another approach could be to bring in SMEs for different parts of the team.

Head Coach: Brian Mac
Forwards Coach: Jamie Peacock
Halfback Coach: Sean Long
Hooking Coach: Kieran Cunningham
Fullback Coach: Paul Wellens
Centres Coach: Keith Senior
Wing Coach: Jason Robinson
Defensive Coach: Paul Anderson
Kicking Coach: Kevin Sinfield
Motivational Speaker: Shaun Wane
Waterboy: Steve McBanana

Of course some of this is tongue in cheek, but we need to sort out the International Game.