Not sure that is the case - the top standard of the U20s is well above the all but the top of the championship IMO, Sheffield are the best side in the championship but the whole back line can't tackle - that is the standard of the league.

Without some games between such teams, we can't prove either way. However, if I think of matches such as Sheffield vs Broncos, there were Broncos players who were standout players at U20s level that weren't able to stand out against Sheffield.

Richie as I said Sheffield are the best side in that league - I would like to see Leeds/Wigan/Saints U20s v Keighley, Dewsbury, York, Hunslet, Workington etc

We won't see those games though The others closest comparison I can come up with is that there's a lad I used to coach who later played SL U20s and finished as his teams top try scorer two years in a row, he's currently on loan to a Championship club but unable to get selected.

At a seminar I attended a couple of years ago, Steve McNamara and another RFL official explained they felt UK player development suffered because the U20s was too weak. Players were able to stand out at U20s but the jump to SL was too much. That's why we saw increasing numbers of juniors out on loan to Championship clubs, which have course has gone much further with dual reg.

Both situations imply the quality of the Championships, compared to SL junior clubs is much higher than you suggest.

This is one of the funniest things I have ever read on these boards.

You have predicted the decline of this squad since at least 2010 due to Leeds' poor forward planning. After the last 2 years you have said the coach is useless and it's the players doing. The same players who you told us would be useless and past it by now. The fact we have won 6 out of the last 9 Super League titles and this year are only 5 points off the top of the League (despite a pretty bad injury list and dropping unlucky points at Cas, Wigan and arguably Warrington) shows we aren't doing too much wrong.

On Hood...meh. Never looked a candidate to be a serious hooking option to me. Interesting to see if all these SL clubs who clearly wanted him on loan this year will take a punt on him next year.

I think you will find that even the lower Championship teams are better than the U19s. Not necessarily as individuals, but sheer size and mass is an advantage.

Leeds academy play Hunslet every year in the Lazenby cup. Leeds usually just win, but that's because the academy side have 5 or 6 Leeds fringe players too - the likes of Richard Moore and Ian Kirk to name but a few, I seem to remember last year.

So, would Leeds U19s beat bottom team Hunslet without any over 19 players. The answer would be definitely not IMO. ALSO, will all the over 19 players get a game at Hunslet next year? Probably not imo

Agree W55ARE - absolute cr*p that the Championship teamns wouldn't flatten the best U19s - particularly if they played them every week. I'd back Championship sides against England U19 for the reasons you mention.

The old reserve teams (if they still existed) would also be beaten by Championship teams IMO. Proably the only time that wouldn't have been true was when Wigan were dominant and had a big squad including internationals regularly playing reserves.

In any event, if Hood is failing to shine at a supposedly rubbish level, isn't that his fault? Its nothing to do with the standard they are at. Or are some suggesting that despite it being a supposedly low standard that good players cannot shine there? Ridiculous.

I've yet to see any proof for the mystery SL clubs seeking him on loan this year either. Or the queue for next season.

some pretty stupid / ignorance comments

brad singleton has improved in all areas of his game since playing for dewsbury & hunslet. If he hadn't & was ready 2/3 years ago like you claim don't you think the bottom teams would have come in for him? wakefield didn't even think he was good enough this year at the start of the season & sent him packing after 1 game.

foster, is he that kid that repeatedly keeps getting run over the top of?...no doubt foster has potential but he's a long way off being a regular super league player or even getting near the 19 when everyone is fit. as for him being better that keinhorst you're having a laugh.

foster went to hunslet because they were struggling to raise 17 players with their injuries and the 19's didn't have a game that week, thus him & mcavoy went and played for them; foster by all accounts was shown up with quite a lot of his defence reads & efforts. (feel free to find the highlights on youtube and watch Liam Kaye stroll past him). mcavoy hasn't been back since despite them still struggling for forwards; they played with a prop, a winger, a hooker & a stand off on the bench at the weekend. is this because the 19's is better for mcavoy or because mcavoy isn't good enough for hunslet? personally i doubt hunslet have even asked for him again, preferring to have backrowers playing prop & wingers in the backrow.

Duckworth isn't old enough to go out on dual reg (see last point)

Chisholm had a few games before being dropped and hasn't played since. surely if the 19'2/20's was so good / championship poor he should be able to get a game in the championship every week?

the championship is the most level & even league, the difference between top & bottom is fairly small; the top 5 were pretty clear to pick before the season, but the other 9 teams have next to nothing between them & any of them 9 teams beating the top 5 isn't that much of an upset. hence why there has been 70 bonus points awarded so far and very few blow out scores. playing at the top of super league would no doubt be better for development but playing at the likes of london, salford, cas will not.

i've no doubt leeds/wigan 19's would be near the bottom of the league, even both these top teams are full of players who aren't good enough for championship (yet). (sadly many players seem to have the same opinion as you and hence think they are going to be to good for the league & soon find themselves sat in the stands because of the attitude of 'i'm to good to be here so don't have to put the effort in training & can get away with doing stupid/miracle things in games')

hood hasn't regressed at hunslet, he just isn't good enough imo. he has some really good stuff in his game, but his weaknesses have been shown up more in the championship than they were at 20's & he hasn't improved any of these points to a standard that would be good enough for leeds. no doubt he'll get a gig in the championship next year but none sure there will be many/any super league offers and even if he does get one i expect him to see large parts of the season in the championship on dual-reg/loan unless he has a big improvement in the next 6 months

you can't be dual registered at that age, you have to be 18 at the start of the season (iirc), which is pretty stupid but what do you expect from the RFL. which means the likes of baldwinson are old enough to player super league but not old enough to play for championship teams on dual reg.

Maybe we should all be watching the championship, Foster seems to have coped pretty well at SL level against the likes of Warrington but can cut it against championship sides!! I suggest you have an agenda!! or are least rose tinted glasses.

I don't understand your correlation between ex academy players playing SL and the quality of Championship teams. For oe thing, it doesn't seem to take into account any progress those players would make after leaving an academy.

How do you prepare your stars of te future? A combination of easing them in, and loaning periods at levels of competition higher than junior RL. Some players might need one of those, some both.

I still think you are way off in your assessment of the quality of the Championship, for the reasons given along with those from W55ARE, BrisbaneRhino and MHL.

no agenda, i watch more leeds games than any other club but realistic in players abilities & just find it funny that people think the 19's is a better standard than the championship*. Foster did cope (in a fashion) against wire, but it was very easy to tell he was a young kid & wouldn't have been playing if it wasn't for injuries; morley was running over the top of him like he was a 6 or 7. Someone like stevie ward on the other hand got into the team and looked like he's been playing for years.

*hence me raising the point on fosters game for hunslet, i didn't watch the game so can't comment personally but the comments i heard was he was ok in attack but pretty poor in defence. Surely if the 19's is better than championship then foster should have no issue defending for hunslet? or looking better than "ok" in attack? for the try that is showed on the hightlights foster did not move forward, had his feet planted, allowed kaye to get on the outside of him, and made a pretty poor diving attempt at a tackle that barely touched the attacker. This may well have actually been his only poor defence in the game, but it certainly doesn't look like defence of a super league player or even defence of a good championship player.

Nobody has said the 19's is better than the championship. Where did you come up with that from?

That's the issue, the level of competition in the 19's is why players are loaned out.

What was said, is the the likes of Leeds and Wigan produce enough good players, to have a very good under 19's team, and that that under 19's team would be battling out for the top at the championship. Which they would do. Can't understand why you are arguing on that one.

Can't believe you were quick to critisize Foster for a performance for Hunselt, which you now say you didn't see, and yet he put two very good performances in either side of that game in Super League.

Come on Andy, back this up. Show me the post that claimed that this squad is in decline. You see Gareth states these things for banter, you on the other hand don't really know what you are saying, you just say it. So back it up.

For your information at least 8 players have left the squad since 2010 to what we have now, and Delaney is now a recognised back rower rather than the position he came for at centre. In 2011 there were 6 changes to the GF winning side to what played regularly in 2010. Even in 2012 there was a further 4.

The squad was changed dramatically.

What was said by me and was quite clear about, and obviously where your mind wanders, is that unless we changed the way we were working the academy thend it would seriously effect us going forward. Inparticular I said they needed to get Poaching out of the job. Remind me what happened again? look at us now at academy. Who was right again?



He is uselss, I honestly think he is even more useless than I initially thought. Take Peacock and Sinfield out of the side and it would have struggled to make top 8, and yet they are actually at times playing better rugby than the previous year. He is taking this club so far backwards it frustrates the hell out of me. The players are the difference for the win, I would take some convincing to accept he has played any part, however I have already said if he manages to win it this year I will give him some credit for it.




Again, which are thes players? It already been established how many changes we have had, so which players are you referring to?




I can't argue with your first point on that. All I can do is look at the here and now, and I have always been the sort who looks to the future rather than the past. I want it to continue and will raise concerns as they come about.





I bet you wasn't saying that last year. Funny how all these comments come out now. Why would clubs come knocking now? he's regressed due to the development path given. Isn't that the point?

I would say that players take the following path:
U19s > Hunslet > Salford/London/Widnes > Leeds

Obviously people can skip steps, but that would be how I view it