JJB for Bailey?

For me Hull played well and deserved their win. I'm not sure I buy the 'they would have beaten anyone' line. When we got beaten by Saints yes, but there was not anything like that level of performance from Hull. We weren't as awful as we usually are when we lose, but we certainly weren't on song.

I think Leeds are still in a better position form-wise than they were this time last year. Hull had to respond after Wigan gave them a hell of a beating, and they also had an extra week to prepare. It was that freshness that gave them the edge IMO, in addition to executing a solid gameplan for 80 minutes.

A few individual performances disappointed me.

I don't see what Clarkson is bringing to the team any more. Kirke is actually stepping it up now but I have the feeling Clarkson is more deserving of criticism at the moment - I haven't seen his stats so maybe he's doing the unglamorous work that doesn't stand out.

Lunt was poor, making a couple of seemingly unforced errors that were pretty costly, and lacking the penetration showed against the Catalans - perhaps the latter just a case of the forwards not laying the platform... He did look worryingly vulnerable though, perhaps giving some indication to why Hudds don't see him as a priority.

That was the worst performance from Hardaker I have seen this season. He really needs to sort out his passing to Hall, but I also had the feeling Leeds had decided to target the right where young Crooks seemed to be making a few defensive blunders in the first half. This was the first time in a while Hardaker didn't look to be as much of a threat with the ball, and he seemed to be a bit clumsy in defence (falling over other players, going for the ankle tap on Briscoe too soon when he might have been better served trying to chase him down, etc).

On a more positive note, I thought Lee Smith injected himself well and really offered something different from the bench - definitely deserves more time in this role. Ablett, Delaney and Peacock all impressed. Some nice touches from Webb and McGuire, but not regularly enough.

We are still missing Buderus - both in terms of his distribution (Lunt seemed to offer this before) and leading of the defensive line. Obviously Burrow, Watkins and Bailey would have made a difference.

Is the time right for this Leeds side to undergo the kind of transformation that took place during 2000-2001, where a number of young players were brought into the side together to form the core of a successful team going forward?

IMO Leeds are where they will finish at the end of the regular season - 7th. They are the weakest side of the top half of the competition, but will be strong enough over the rest of the season to hold off the likes of Bradford and Hull KR behind them. From that position, and given the deficiencies in the side, they aren't going to go on and win the Grand Final.

It's highly unlikely the run of favourable draws in the Cup will continue even if they get past Leigh, so IMO it's a Cup semi-final and a first round playoff defeat at best in 2012. A perfect opportunity to start refreshing the squad during the off-season.

I think you're being too pessimistic about the current squad's chances, although I reserve the right to join you in this position if we don't see much improvement against the better sides in the next couple of months. I very much doubt the coaching staff or players share this opinion.

At best?

Hmmmm.

Or maybe Leeds will continue to peak at the right time and save their best for when matters.

Wholesale changes now would be called hitting the panic button. I'm glad our coaching staff are in charge rather than some of the would-be Masterplanners round here.

That's my opinion.

The 2012 vintage Leeds Rhinos have so far this season been spanked at three of the sides currently above them in the table and beaten by one of the others at home.

Again - in my opinion - the 2012 vintage is not as good a side as the 2011 one. Some players have declined, others have been brought in that are not up to the standard of the players they are replacing. There were times during that 2011 season where the side gave glimpses of what was to come in the playoffs. Those have been few and far between in 2012.

Expecting it to go on the sort of winning run that climaxed the 2011 season is - again, IMO - unrealistic.

Self-portait?

If you see us in a hole, we were in a bigger one this time last year. Our results weren't dropping in and so far this year we've shown our ability to win some of the big games (WCC/Wire). This group of players know when to peak. If they save their best for last again I can't see why we can't cash in again.

The glimpses that we showed last year, weren't at this stage of the season though were they? Maybe you should reserve judgement and see what they can/can't produce.

This side can't do it forever that much is obvious. Competitions and clubs evlove, we've had our lot for a lifetime some would argue. But the blend we have know how to get the job done to a level no other team can compete with.

People made similar remarks last year, you are not re-inventing the wheel. Time will tell whether you have egg on your face or not. I'd have a hanky ready just in case.

These doom laden comments always come after a stinking defeat. People make big judgements against small stock.

While I agree that winning from outside the top 4 would be a difficult feat to repeat, I still think we're in better nick than this time last season. There are probably more teams looking capable of being competitive than last season, but I think our form has been better. The home games against Catalan and Wire (albeit when they had some players out) were decent performances, but we haven't been able to maintain that level. At some of our lower points this year (Saturday and the Hudds home game, for instance) we've looked flat and off the boil, but nothing to compare to the home-field bummings we got from Wire and Hudds in spring and early summer 2011. In my opinion.

The idea of bringing in a group of youngsters together a la 2000/2001 is appealing in some ways, but my recollection is that those changes were very much enforced by injuries etc. I'd rather see a steady trickle into the first team, with increasing game time (and loans where appropriate) for the likes of Ward, Hood, Singleton etc. Hardaker and BJB are also very much works-in-progress, so that process of refreshing the squad is already happening.

The youngsters in 2000/2001 got their backsides handed to them painfully a couple of times that I recall (and I was away at Liverpool Uni at the time so only really got to Saints and Wigan away matches, so I can't comment on the whole season). It worked out in the long run, but I can't see any real need to do that this season.

We have a lot of the top sides at home yet, plus a came in hand v wakefield at home. I think fourth, even third is possible yet.we have dropped silly points though imo

Pack need to play better as a unit and it would be good if the halves posed more of an attacking threat. I think we'll be there or thereabouts for both cup and grand final but probably place somewhere mediocre in the league.

I think that like last year, we are targeting the one trophy that has eluded this group - the Challenge Cup.
And again like last season, if we fail, the back up will be the Grand Final. My concern is that this year there appears to be more competition in the League and this strategy may not work as well as it did last time!

Batley and backwoodsman have already made the point that I'd make.
i.e. start our players 6, 7 and 13 at positions 6, 7 and 13 and we'ld improve immediately.


In the latter end of last season, we saw Leeds' key players reverting to their natural 6, 7 and 13 positions in the second half of games and winning games like that.
McDermott got off the hook because of it.