The other side to that is Wigan didn't play that well in either game - Leeds would struggle to play better - unlikely Wigan will play worse tbh.

Perhaps, and I accept im clutching at straws here, they will freeze. Wembley can do funny things to a player. Remeber Jonathan Davies...

If we do manage to play to our full potential (with the squad we have), Wigan will have to be fantastic on the day to beat us.

That's all there is to it.

Aye. I remember him. Scoring in the corner against Australia.

I meant playing for Widnes in the CC Final.

Well, if you're going to ask people for their abiding memory of Davies at Wembley it's going to be the one LTID came up with so you gave a poor example.

the game entirely depends on which Rhinos and which Wigan turn up. If we play like we did in the 5 weeks prior to the 'Quins game, we've got a decent chance. Any team with the likes of Webb, Jones-Bishop, Watkins, McGuire, Burrow, Buderus, Sinfield and Peacock in it can blow any other team off the park.

The exact same is true for Wigan with the Tomkins brothers, Carmont, Deacon, Richards et al.

We turned in 2 good showings against Wigan in the games this season, and were unlucky in the 1st and cheated in the 2nd (where we had a good try chalked off and they a bad one allowed).

If we play the same way we did against Quins, we'll get cut to ribbons. That said, we played against Quins without our 3 key forwards who, let's be honest, have carried the pack this year.

The benefit of being underdogs (and, ironically, of the Quins game) is that the buildup has left us with little pressure. Nobody expects us to do anything but take a pasting, so we're free to go out, play our game and try and enjoy it. If Wigan do anything less than stroll it, they'll have underperformed in the eyes of many.

For me, the first 20 minutes is key. Keep ourselves in the game and the numerous wigan fans expecting that pasting will start to get on their team's back, and the Wigan players will feel that pressure.

The other key is the side. If Watkins is out, Smith has to play IMO, and it is vital that McGuire, Burrow, Sinfield & Buderus all start. Our best play this season has been when all 4 of them are on the park.

My side for Wembley

Webb
Jones-Bishop
Watkins (if fit)/Smith
Ablett
Hall
McGuire
Burrow
Bailey
Buderus
Peacock
Jones-Buchanan
Delaney
Sinfield

Leuluai
Pitts
Hauraki
Kirke

In reference to the original question, McDermott has just said that "It doesn't come down much to tactics or a gameplan in a final". rlhttp://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/georgeriley/2011/08/the_two_most_recent_super.htmlrl

Whilst that is by necessity true for any team coached by McDermott and Lowes, perhaps he should check with some coaches who've won finals and had gameplans before making that statement.

Has he said 'we're not going looking for the win' like he did last time we played Wigan?

I'm afraid to click on the link and see for myself.

He's not the first coach to say something along those lines.

I don't have any issues with what he said - he's right. If either side start off over-awed they can lose the game before they really get going. That can outweigh quality and tactics. Having said that, I expect a details oriented coach like Maguire will minimise the chances of that happening to Wigan.

I would say that John Kear has won two cup finals with underdog sides very much by getting them to stick to a game plan.

Clearly there are other factors at play as well though.

Of course there will be a game plan, but what he has said is perfectly valid. It's just how he expresses his thoughts is sometimes a little...odd.

[sizeI need to read the AUP before I post again[/size

McDermott was confident Leeds could win today. Reckoned the wet weather might play into their hands.

Hope the passing Saints fans don't see that.

*****flash-back alert*****