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Quote: Keith Swiftcorn "Executing good passes has never been a consistent part of Senior's armoury either. He's average in that department at best, and when he's below average his pass often ends up on the deck or in Row Z.

Senior's main attributes throughout his career have been

I agree that for most of his career he was a biff and barge merchant and very good at it. However in the last few years I have seen Keith Senior develop a fantastic partnership with Ryan Hall. Unless I’m just imagining that Keith Senior was the last hands in the passages of play before Hall has gone in for a try, I think that Keith has actually got better since retiring from international rugby.

I do know that opta keep stats and will be finding the stats sometime through this week to back my point up. At the moment I’m on row Z and it’ll take a Keith Senior pass into it to wake me up icon_wink.gif

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LEEDS RHINOS - SUPER LEAGUE 3 TIMES IN A ROW CHAMPIONS NOW 4 OUT OF 5 2007 & 2008 & 2009 & 2011 ST HELENS 16- 32 LEEDS RHINOS (never underestimate a Rhino!) LEEDS RHINOS 18-10 ST HELENS LEEDS RHINOS 24-16 ST HELENS ST HELENS 6-33 LEEDS RHINOS WORLD CLUB CHAMPIONS 2008 & 2012 LEEDS RHINOS 26-12 MANLY SEA EAGLES LEEDS RHINOS 11-4 MELBOURNE STORM That's Why We're Champions, That's Why We're Champions! That's Why We're Champions, That's Why We're Champions! Kevin Sinfield (8th October 2011) "‎Last but not least, to all those people that wrote this team off, to all those people who criticised this team, tonight's for you!":34296.jpg



Over the years I have watched Senior I know he has been the heart of the best Leeds wing Partnership and whenever this has been in doubt he has switched wings to help cover the weakness! Great Pro and can I bid for his 400 shirt?

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You have to hope he is not going play that much this season - his defense has always been suspect even in his prime today it would have been funny had it not been so bad.

What's the betting he gets another contract extension about June

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Quote: Damo-Leeds "Senior just had a bad game today.'"


Plus ca change?

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Quote: Sal Paradise "today it would have been funny had it not been so bad.'"


I'm sure in that case you'll have no trouble pointing out all those breaks Bradford made down their right hand side against Senior's appalling defence?

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Quote: Andy Gilder "I'm sure in that case you'll have no trouble pointing out all those breaks Bradford made down their right hand side against Senior's appalling defence?'"


They didn't need to break it, just put a kick there.

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Quote: Gotcha "They didn't need to break it, just put a kick there.'"


Riiight, so Senior is responsible for not noticing that Brent Webb had - yet again - gone AWOL for Whitehead's first two tries then?

Seriously?

If that's the point you're trying to make, you're just embarrassing yourself.

I'll give you Whitehead's third try, although there were three other Leeds players stood around the ball who were equally culpable for not taking the initiative and dealing with it.

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Quote: Andy Gilder "I'm sure in that case you'll have no trouble pointing out all those breaks Bradford made down their right hand side against Senior's appalling defence?'"


I don't need just review the game and see how many tries Bradford scored when Senior was watching the player who scored run past him and at the point of scoring Senior was 10 metres down the pitch looking on?

Tries 1 and 2 - in fact all 3 of Whitehead's for a start - Senior is supposed to lead by example not abdicate his responsibilities.

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Quote: Andy Gilder "If that's the point you're trying to make, you're just embarrassing yourself.'"


I'll refrain from any over emotion comments, and just reverse the point back to you.

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Quote: Gotcha "I'll refrain from any over emotion comments, and just reverse the point back to you.'"


I notice you've avoided responding to the actual point raised though.

Are you seriously suggesting (much as Sal seems to be) that Senior was at fault for not preventing Whitehead's first two tries?

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Quote: Andy Gilder "Riiight, so Senior is responsible for not noticing that Brent Webb had - yet again - gone AWOL for Whitehead's first two tries then?

Seriously?

If that's the point you're trying to make, you're just embarrassing yourself.

I'll give you Whitehead's third try, although there were three other Leeds players stood around the ball who were equally culpable for not taking the initiative and dealing with it.'"


It is Senior's poor positional sense that causes problems. For one of the kicks on Sunday Senior had not slid out and left a gap which invited a kick through for Whitehead to run onto.

While for high bombs that come his way, his tactic is to run underneath the ball and leave catching it to someone else (on Sunday he left it to the smallest player on the pitch) Not only is this a cop out for someone who is physically suitable to collect bombs, but it leaves him isolated on the wrong side of the ball and unable to defend his line.

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Those tries appeared mainly to come from Leeds being a man down and Webb pushing up into the line instead of condencing the defence and forcing Bradford to try and find an overlap. It was asking for the kick through into the deep in-goal areas and Bradford were good enough to execute those plays. Poor defensive alignment.

Senior did get ahead of the defence for one of them but I don't think it would have made a difference to the scoring opportunity had he held station.

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1 Warrington 2 Hull 3 Wigan 4 Castleford 4 Castleford 5 St Helens 6 Leeds 7 Catalans 8 Hudedersfield 9 Widnes 10 Wakefield 11 Salford 12 Leigh Playoffs:Warrington Hull Wigan Castleford Four sides rejoining: Widnes Wakefield Salford Leigh GF Winners Warrington CC Winners Wigan:



Quote: Keith Swiftcorn "Executing good passes has never been a consistent part of Senior's armoury either. He's average in that department at best, and when he's below average his pass often ends up on the deck or in Row Z.

Senior's main attributes throughout his career have been

I, too, hate to say it but I also agree with the above.

Re Kicks & positional play I'm not clever enough to know where he should stand nor how he should defend when we're down to 12 men BUT I have long been amazed how our tallest back is never tasked with being the one to jump for the ball when a kick goes up on his side.
It was laughable to see Senior stand & watch as Burrow leapt almost as high as Senior's shoulder for the last of Whitehead's tries.
I thought one thing that Potter did bring to the Bulls attack was the kick to the centre not to the wing, for all 3 tries from kicks.

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Quote: tvoc "Those tries appeared mainly to come from Leeds being a man down and Webb pushing up into the line instead of condencing the defence and forcing Bradford to try and find an overlap. It was asking for the kick through into the deep in-goal areas and Bradford were good enough to execute those plays. Poor defensive alignment.

Senior did get ahead of the defence for one of them but I don't think it would have made a difference to the scoring opportunity had he held station.'"


Fair comment and why I don't blame Web on this one.

However Senior does regularly get himself on the wrong side of the defensive line and for high kicks appears to go to try and obstruct rather than go for the ball. I cannot last recall when he jumped off the ground to try and collect a kick.

Regarding the defensive alignment, is there an argument for a return of the sweeper? The odds now seem to favour the kicker who produces so many scores in the current game.

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The problem yesterday was there being no full-back, never mind a sweeper, in the defensive allignment for those soft tries conceded entirely from within our red zone.

No real need for sweepers in the modern game is there where teams tend to concentrate on playing out their full compliment with scoots from dummy half and drives often just one off the ruck. The inventive play (often early in the tackle count) that required teams to employ a sweeper is no longer viewed as a high percentage play. Nice to see Iestyn Harris challenge the convention on re-starts, I hope there is more of this to come and I think there is. Only a matter of time IMO before Harris finds himself at a top club.

I agree Senior appears to have an aversion to catching kicks more usually opting to use his frame to shield a designated catcher. Problem yesterday for Whitehead's hat-trick score was that nobody took responsibility for it. It was a clever kick and a tactic teams have used successfully in the past aiming at Burrow and McGuire rather than Hall and whoever Leeds have on the opposite flank.

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