No they weren't at all. They had a couple out like most teams but definitely not anything major. Marty Smith missed the start of the year but even on his return he's been a big disappointment and Saints fans argue that he's been their worst signing in a long time.

And they did recover from their start as they were in pole position for a playoff spot after beating Cas week 1 of the 8's, they then lost the next 3 which have left them relying on others losing. They win those 3 they'd be 2nd right now so completely wrong to blame the start.

Gotcha has been over rating the Saints for the past few seasons.

They are around where they should be for me, we are probably over achieving granted and are about the same level as them as a side on the whole. Both teams are a pale shadow of a few years back and wouldn't be near contending for anything pre 2012.

I may well have thought they would do better this year, but not sure where the over rating other years would come from? I always said their coach was a problem, something they took the right action on earlier this year, and something they will reap the benefits of after a full preseason next year.

i recall you including them as an example as a side better than us and further down the road to rebuilding over the last few years although, granted you have said they lack a proper coach at times.

We will see what their new coach brings next year with a full pre season behind him. I'm still of the belief they have average halves, average three quarters and a plodder pack in general.

average half, average three quarters and a plodder pack.reminds me of us

It's been said often this year that we'd be nowhere if Parcell and/or Cuthbertson got injured. I think looking at Saints you could've said the same thing for 3 years now with Roby and Walmsley.

correct, like i said, i think us and Saints are about the same level on paper

Think our backs are above average though, but with our playing style and lack of structure they don't get chance to max their potential and they therefore fall under the average category, but it's hardly been a recent phenomenon has it?

fully agree with you. Take them 2 out of Saints pack you have LMS, Wilkin, Amor, Thompson etc... average is being kind.

Amor's an interesting one because just the other week on the Saints board they were criticising him saying that whilst he was good in his first year he hasn't done much since really and are very low on him at the moment.

Hard to disagree there though. I thought WTF did we let him go after the first year there, but he has been a plodder since and not kicked on really.

Absolutely, a mate of mine said we should get him back, why ? he would not make one iota of difference to our forward ' strength

Amor back to Wakey is what i have heard.
Not from a too reliable source though.

Did Frosties tell you that?

Not this time lol