I'd hope he might end up at Leeds for a couple of seasons but as long as Leeds continue to produce and roll out the SL quality halves the like of David Gibbons, Gavin Brown, Paddy Handley, Jonny Hepworth, Scott Murrell and Ben White's of this world then priorities clearly lay elsewhere.

Re the two kicks - Different ends of the pitch so as both are right foot, instep kickers one of those 'similar' kicks was with a natural shape while the other was against it.

Lilley kicked one last week at Widnes off the 'wrong' touchline, Sinfield's (IMO) greatest conversion was in the Huddersfield CC SF of 2003, Lee Crooks' two pointer to draw a Test (and World Cup Qualifying) match at Elland Road in '85 also springs to mind - great kicks because, the latter two at least, were under the most extreme of pressures.

Hardaker failed his first real test of a pressure kick (arguably first two tests V Warrington) and was almost universally condemned on here, most (IIRC) offering the opinion had Lilley been given the job one or both points would have gone to Leeds, well that jury may have to reconsider their verdict on their favoured alternative given this latest evidence.

I seem to remember Sutty nailing one of those pressure kicks (at least on a par with the one Zak missed against Wire) against Catalan. Is he out of kicking contention because of his knee? Because when Sinifield wasn't on last year it was Sutty who kicked.

Lilley looks a natural kicker, but is not guaranteed a spot when everyone's fit.

Hardaker is a strange one,I seem to remember a couple of games where he's kicked really well, but at the same time he's just as capable of going one from four.

All 3 with work could be vaiable options, but at the minute non have really seperated themselves from the rest.

Think JJB and Ward said during their USA game commentary he had done a bit of goal kicking whilst over in Florida (along with Hardaker, Lilley, Golding and Cam Smith). But he must have only just started again around that time after several months out so might be rusty/kicking poorly upon his return.

bring back furner he was effin brilliant

Did you see Morgan play? he is there purely for his running game, he isnt even a second choice kicker as they get the fullback to do it, how is that different to burrow?
also if Hardaker was in the NRL there would be alot more emphasis on set plays making it much easier to pass and get assists as the overlap is created infield

Morgan can pass and kick. He is mainly a runner but he knows how to suck in defenders and get the ball away, and doesn't kill moves every time he gets the ball. He also plays alongside the world's best which helps a lot.

Hardaker plays head down rugby for Leeds, and in our current structure we need him to be much more of a link. You are right to say he'd be involved in more set plays in the NRL, but so was Hoffman who also dies with the ball far too often. As a result he's no longer considered a first choice full back. Hardaker may do better, but the point is he'd have to fundamentally change how he plays.

My issue is, why aren't these players continually trying to improve the obvious flaws in their game? There's no real reason why Hardaker couldn't pass more. There's also no reason why Burrow can't think about setting up plays rather than darting around aimlessly and changing direction all the time. In SL they are stars. I really don't think its too harsh to say they wouldn't be in the NRL without considerable improvement in core skills for their positions.

I picked on Leeds players because I support Leeds. I could give a critique of every British player and point out problems across the board, but that would be dull. A big difference between SL and NRL is down to the fact that the flaws across the NRL are generally smaller, and players with flaws get found out and punted. Recent examples being Barba as a fullback/playmaker, Hoffman as a fullback and the likes of Tim Smith at halfback. That's why I worry about Widdopp for England as I think he got shown up a lot last year and needs to improve immensely if he is to lead England against Australia.

I read an interesting piece recently about St. George moving Dugan from fullback because they wanted more of a playmaker there. I think Hardakers Game is very similar to Dugan. The same piece also questioned the Roosters moving Ferguson to the back because he was more of a runner, but that still seems to be the way they've gone.

I think Hardaker would go perfectly alright in the NRL, but I the minute we don't seem to be giving him the opportunity to excel, often getting the ball stood still or moving laterally.

If Hardaker is getting the ball stood still or moving laterally then that's down to him not picking or timing his run properly. And then unfortunately it seems as if he doesn't know where to run or what to do when he has the ball.

I think Hardaker is a good example of the difference between NRL and SL.
He's about the best we've got to offer at full back but he has big gaps in his skill set, especially his mental skill set. Decision making & focus when attacking aren't evident in him, probably because his physical skills (speed, evasion etc) have always seen him through so he hasn't needed to develop his passing, timing or position of run, who to run at etc. Except against the top defences speed and evasion will only get you so far, at some point your attack has to be part of, and fit in with the team as a whole. Pretty much the epitome of what plagues the sport in terms of player development.

Now the positive side is his defence, which is superb, the best in the world by some distance in my opinion. That's something that he learned in fairly short order and requires focus to consistently perform to a high standard (which he's done). So he can do it, I think the trick will be making him want to do it. Hopefully a few "set backs" like the kicking and not getting through some defences for a while just on his physicality may be good for him in the long run.

I agree he could make better decisions, and that they would give him an extra half second I'm hopeful as our young halves get more game time (or Mags returns) the quality of ball to all the backs will improve.

I think it's worth remembering Zak spent his early games at wing and centre. The best linkers (Webb, Tomkins) have spent time in a halfback role. Hopefully it's something Zak can improve on.

I agree on the points on Hardaker, but think we have been spoilt previously with what we had. Having Sinfield and Webb in made our recognised half backs look like they had a better skill set than they did. The loss of Webb put emphasis on McGuire to adjust his game. Burrows game is no different to what it was 10 years ago, hence the move into hooker instead for the most part.

The point on if taking the ball stood still is the players fault, I don't think is valid. Look at the passing from Burrow, and you can count on one hand the number of times in a season he puts a player through a gap. It doesn't happen, and this is what we are having to rely on at the moment. His game is all about his runs, and without that there isn't a back up. Burrow either does the pass from dummy half, or he runs, and can't not do a pass quick enough.

Agree with all that except that most of the time Hardaker is receiving the ball as the rearmost runner in an "out the back" shape, so he's not going to be put through a gap by the pass anyway, so if he's not in the right place that's mostly up to him. Though I'd agree on Burrow in general which, as you say, is why he's been moved from half back to bench hooker.

Micheal morgan doesnt pass that much and if he does its pretty basic just catch and pass to the centre, never really does any decision making or cut out balls, he basically plays at fullback without the defensive work, much like a young Burrow he is there purely to make breaks and score tries, but thats all NQC need him to do.

As fo Hardaker linking, I dont think the problem lies solely on him, going back to 06-12 seasons we had sinfield Mcguire and Webb all throwing big cutout passes to wingers from about 15-20 yards in field, in recent seasons no-one is throwing them so it must be down to our playing style, what is Hardakers flaw is not getting himself through gaps enough and hitting lines.

Barba got a Dally M one year so I dont think you can say he didnt succeed, his lack of form was mainly down to 2 years of being injured wasnt it? Also regaurding Widdop I wouldnt be too worried, hes in the top 5 6s in the world easily after Milford Foran and maybe a couple of others.
There arent many players who have an all round game and can do everything, even in the NRL, theres only Thurston, Hunt, Pearce and Johnson who dont have any glaring flaws (in attack at least) or dont need to be assigned particular roles by their clubs
Adam Reynolds for example has the best kicking game in the world imo, but hasnt got much of a running game so the coach puts Keary next to him, most halves arent allrounders
If our players do have a weakness in their game, it is their job to improve, but our coaches job give them roles that play to their stregnths

Tell you what, rob mulhern is having a great game tonight.

Hmmm. I wouldn't go that far. He did a good run but he also got knocked on his backside a couple of times.

I only had it on in the background but I saw him do a few good things. From what I saw H e was having more of an impact on the game than Walters or achurch usually do. (Grand final right place at right time excluded). Mind that's not saying much.