I think we need freshening up in the squad and the coaching staff, we need structure in both attack and d!

Factors of poor form, shocking discipline, shocking ability to do the basics, poor rotation etc!

We have the players but the team looks really jaded to me and its down to poor rotation of the squad, if we are to put up with these poor showings in the first half of the season. we need to give the young lads ago here and not out on loan. all this about they will be playing against men is hogwash. The old principle of "if they are good anough they are old anough" comes to mind, Can't beat a pair of fresh eager legs to give the energy look at wigan and saints.
At the begginning of the season I thought we would have the fastest threequarter line of any club but sadly it seems to have gone astray.
The lack of basics which have been mentioned all season was in clear view on Friday and if B Mc can't see it its definatley time to go. In fact when we were walking from the long bar on Friday night A fellow was following some yards behind dragging a case and my lad says 'that hasn't taken hetherington long to take action dad has it'.

This is what it boils down to for me. We have seen it in many sporting teams in the past and it has happened at Wigan in the past. Old players way past their best being kept on in blind loyalty for their past deeds, Peacock, Maguire and Sinfield immediately spring to mind. Having just a couple of players like this is okay but throw in the likes of Webb, Bailey etc and it is a rapidly aging, and slow, team that are declining rapidly. No doubt these players are also taking up a huge chunk of the salary cap as well.

Some tough decisions need to be made at Headingley and some of these players need to be replaced and fresh, younger players brought in. If Leeds just continue like everything is fine they will end up with a pretty mediocre team, probably much like Bradford are now, in a couple of years. This isnt any anti-Leeds bile as I lived in Headingley as a student and used to go quite regularly. However that was quite a number of years ago now and many of the players that were coming through then, Sinfield, Maguire and co are still the core of the team now and are no where near the players they once were.

Agree with all of that.
Why we let Sinfield play at 6 when he clearly has no pace or organisation as a half back.
Burrow runs round like a headless chicken and McGuire feeds off scraps as a poacher.
We have nobody at half back to dictate play like other teams do.
Smith is far too slow as a winger and his defence is shocking.
Webb is here one year too long even though he is the only one who sems capable of spitting the defence.
The forwards are predicatable and very slow.
Delaney looks knackered Clarkson offers nothing whatsoever. JP and Kylie are ok for 20 minutes and will give everything but again are nothing but battering rams with no offloads.
Lunt has played 2 good games since he arrived and Ablett needs playing in the forwards not as a centre.
That leaves Hardaker who needs to be shifted to the right or play him at SO/FB.
Hall, JJB and Bailey are probably the only 3 who offer anything with maybe Moore.
We need to bring in Singleton, BJB ,Ward and Chisholm and get Hood and Amor back to freshen things up.
Sadly we know this wont happen.
Maybe our senior players Sinfield and JP are running this team as McDermott doesn`t appear to be doing it.
If we are not careful we will end up like Bradford and if Caddick pulls out and our crowds reduce that might not be too long.
As for McDermott getting sacked that wont happen until the end of the season when we might not get in the top 8.
But who knows we might just win the CC and he will get another year of serving up dross week in and week out.

ABSOLUTELY agree with everything here. Could not have put it better myself.

I too think this team will miraculously raise its game for the CC semi: the incentive to plug that medal haul gap will suffice for the core 'old guard'. Then, as you state, there will be another reprieve for the whole damn lot. I actually half hope Wigan hammer us again....as well as getting stuffed by Warrington this week. The kick up the arris is def needed.

I agree,but I wouldnt put Bailey in the group of ageing players just yet

no i wouldn't call him ageing.

i'd call him a show pony who for all his posturing rarely puts in the graft

It's a difficult one. It's ok saying ''ageing players...get rid''. But some of our best players remain the most experienced players.

There were people on here that felt we should be moving on burrow last season, but then he single handedly produced the brilliance that won us the grand final.

When we play well, these players are experienced, but when we play poorly they are aged and past it. The way the team is playing as a unit, and hooker are the 2 biggest issues. Wigan performs brilliantly as a unit.

As bad as we were, i still feel the ''veterans'' have one last glorious hurrah in them. But it's not like our entire team is old, it's just certain players are getting on abit - peacock, leuluai, sinfield, and not far behind burrow and mcguire.

finally, someone on here who doesn't over him or just moronically post 'classic bailey'

don't get me wrong every so often he puts in a top class display. sadly it's nowhere near often enough

There is a minority, I just daren't speak up.
I'm happy to praise him when he plays well, like he did on many occassions last year, and I also don't agree with this image of him as a cheap shot merchant that opposition fans have of him.
He's had a few good games this year, but on Friday he came on, didn't win a collision, him and Moore were really soft defensively, and then he gave away a ridiculous penalty rubbing the forearm in Gelling's face. We were defending our line, down 2 or 3 tries, I would love to know what he was thinking.

People like you are the reason why the Whino's are known and detested the world over - McDermott got that bit right in his post match talk on Sky!

People like me or Whinos fans in general are not responsible for whipping boy SL rabble being whipping boy SL rabble.

Facts are facts.

It's about time whipping boy SL rabble clubs got their act together.

At least that way, clubs like Leeds would be duly punished for being crap throughout the regular season.

They won't be.

World over?thats pushing it a bit innit?Where I now live most people have never heard of Leeds