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| I remain unconvinced that Ward is going to be best used as a pivot in the short/medium term.
I get that there are concerns over his durability and asking him to work as a "battering ram", but from what I see of him at first grade level he's much more effective as a runner than a distributor.
If one of Ward or Sutcliffe is going to slot into that role then IMO it's going to be Sutcliffe.
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Club Owner | 12106 | No Team Selected |
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Oct 2004 | 21 years | |
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| Quote Gotcha="Gotcha"Sorry but that is just taking us backwards. When Ward broke into the team, he was an ever present, going on to win a GF winners ring, and looked very settled, better than some of his collegues. He started off last season like an house on fire, looking every inch our best option around the base of the scrum. had he not got injured, it was more than just a probability that his spot was cemented in that backrow/loose.
He's a much better option than JJB/Clarkson, and is more reliable to be there playing than Delaney.
Now just because of his age, it would seem, you want to start reducing his game time. Ward is not in the same boat as Sutcliffe, as Sutcliffe is indeed in the still learning phase, but Ward is past that early stage and is more in the getting wiser stage.'"
I find myself agreeing with you with unusual regularity this week.  I would be nervous of both Ward and Sutcliffe being the team's main pivots on a regular basis. But I think I would like to see Ward handed more responsibility. Then I don't think another learning season would be bad for Sutcliffe - some rotation time at 6 or 13, maybe used as centre cover in the event of injuries. A couple of months on loan at London or somewhere if they wanted him as a 6 or 13 at top level would not upset me.
If Ward is fit, he should be ready. He was the most exciting academy player I've seen in a fair while. Throw the lad the ball a bit more and let's see what he can do. Do it now while he can have a couple of the old guard alongside him when he has the odd off day - which he will have at his age.
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| Quote Gotcha="Gotcha"Sorry but that is just taking us backwards. When Ward broke into the team, he was an ever present, going on to win a GF winners ring, and looked very settled, better than some of his collegues. He started off last season like an house on fire, looking every inch our best option around the base of the scrum. had he not got injured, it was more than just a probability that his spot was cemented in that backrow/loose.
He's a much better option than JJB/Clarkson, and is more reliable to be there playing than Delaney.
Now just because of his age, it would seem, you want to start reducing his game time. Ward is not in the same boat as Sutcliffe, as Sutcliffe is indeed in the still learning phase, but Ward is past that early stage and is more in the getting wiser stage.'"
Because physically he has proven unable to withstand it. Ward and Sutcliffe are very very young, physically they need protecting.
Having them share the role means they can be rested, can be interchanged, but also when circumstances allow have both on the field at the same time with ward at 13 and Sutcliffe at 6.
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| Quote SmokeyTA="SmokeyTA"Because physically he has proven unable to withstand it. Ward and Sutcliffe are very very young, physically they need protecting.
Having them share the role means they can be rested, can be interchanged, but also when circumstances allow have both on the field at the same time with ward at 13 and Sutcliffe at 6.'"
Delaney has proven unable to withstand it, going by your theory. Should he be only part time aswell?
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| Delany is in the prime of his career. If his body can’t withstand it now he never will. His body has stopped growing, Sutcliffe and Ward aren’t in that position putting too much on their shoulders (in wards case literally) now could ruin their career before it starts.
I think if Ward gets 20 games and Sutcliffe 10-15 this year, and if they are playing 40-50mins instead of 60-70mins per game most of the time then their development wont be harmed and they wont be over-worked.
What we also need to take in to account is the training in and around first grade games. I would rather Ward and Sutcliffe missed a couple of the strength and conditions sessions needed for first team for a few more skills sessions at this stage. If that means they play a few games less im not all that upset about it.
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Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
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| I sem to recall McGuire and Burrow droppinmg straight into the team at a very young age...without the need for all this nuturing.
When we had the barrage of injuries early in the seadon these young player stepped up and showed what thay can do.
Now is the time for them to get some sustained game time.
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| Burrow played from the bench in short spells. McGuire played 4 matches in his first season 13 in his 2nd, and 29 in his third.
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| Quote DoubleAone="DoubleAone"I sem to recall McGuire and Burrow droppinmg straight into the team at a very young age...without the need for all this nuturing.
When we had the barrage of injuries early in the seadon these young player stepped up and showed what thay can do.
Now is the time for them to get some sustained game time.'"
Neither were asked to carry the ball into contact and defend in the middle of the field. What they were doing at a young age and the sort of role expected of Ward are worlds apart.
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| Quote Andy Gilder="Andy Gilder"Neither were asked to carry the ball into contact and defend in the middle of the field. What they were doing at a young age and the sort of role expected of Ward are worlds apart.'"
Correct.
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| Plus Burrow and McGuire came in at a much different time for the club. In the halves you had Harris leaving for RU, Powell was now coach and Ben Walker never worked out.
If you look back at some team lineups from back then you'll even see Karl Pratt starting in the halves a few times.
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| Sutcliffe is 20 played 13 first team games scored 7 tries
Ward is 21 played 11 first team games scored 4 tries.
They are ready and should be playing 6 & 7 next year
Hardaker
Hall
Watkins
Moon
Briscoe
Sutcliffe
Ward
Peacock
McShane/Aiton
Singleton
Ablett
Delaney
Sinfield
Leuleui
JJB
Bailey
Burrow
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| Quote DoubleAone="DoubleAone"Sutcliffe is 20 played 13 first team games scored 7 tries
Ward is 21 played 11 first team games scored 4 tries.
They are ready and should be playing 6 & 7 next year
Hardaker
Hall
Watkins
Moon
Briscoe
Sutcliffe
Ward
Peacock
McShane/Aiton
Singleton
Ablett
Delaney
Sinfield
Leuleui
JJB
Bailey
Burrow'"
Not sure they should be 6&7, but to suggest they are not developed enough physically is just ridiculous. Skills wise and knowing the game would be the only question, and Certainly in Wards case that is covered.
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