The terminology in the manifesto is very clearor if there is a significant and material change in the circumstances that prevailed in 2014, such as Scotland being taken out of the EU against our will.[/i

Yep. The first part "significant and material change" is the gun they have been holding since the referendum defeat. It could be made to apply to pretty much anything they don't like. Sturgeon actually said on Friday during her big statement that they were planning to have another referendum but the EU vote has "accelerated" the process. They were already looking at around 4 years down the road, now they have moved that forward. They were going to call for one anyway, the first moment they thought they could win - no matter what. T

Actually this is fairly catastrophic for them. Previously they were looking at the mechanism for a EU member country splitting and both staying in the EU. Tricky, but not a huge obstacle. What they are faced with now (as it would take around 2 years to plan and hold the referendum - if the UK parliament agrees to it ) is the prospect of being already outside the EU, trying to get back in, put up a full border, trying to enter the Euro and that's all if the EU will have them. With the oil price collapse they are going to be potentially relying on EU money to stay solvent. Will the EU actually want them?

The EU seems to want the Balkan countries !!!? I genuinely don't know, but I suspect their economies are hardly better than those relative to Scotland. It would be a sweet taste of political revenge for the EU to help break up the UK (if the EU doesn't break up first of course)

To repeat, the SNP were already planning to leave the UK as soon as they thought they could win a referendum - it says so in their manifesto. The EU vote was irrelevant, all it did was change the timing slightly. This isn't me speculating, Sturgeon said it on Friday on TV - she said they were planning on 4 years, now they are bringing it forward, but it's still going to take them 2 and that's if any UK government isn't too busy to say yes.
Have you heard the noises the SNP are making about opposing the referendum result in parliament now? They confirm my thoughts that this is a disaster for them and their ultimate goal of breaking up the UK on their terms.
To repeat, yet again, it's fundamental to the SNP to break up the UK. The sheer bloody cheek of them to blame anyone or anything else is beyond belief.

And as for the EU "revenge" theory, don't be soft. With one of their big net contributers leaving do they really want another bill? The Balkans was empire building, expanding borders. None of that applies to Scotland. And the last EU expansion happened before the Euro crisis, before Greece. It's a very different environment now for new.

I'm trying to remain optimistic that the official opposition can get their act together after manufacturing Jexit.

Not on this mornings evidence. He's not going anywhere. By the end of the week the "Shadow Cabinet" will consist of him, McDonald and Dianne Abbott.

Another Gang of Four might just materialise yet....history does repeat itself.

Got to just love the Labour Party MPs. At a time when they should be in the ascendency holding this poxy Gov to account for the almighty shiitestorm they have created with the media baying for answers we have the news dominated by equally self serving pillocks.

I see the EEA option is being slowly dribbled out as the way forward (which won't be so bad if agreed to, but the anti immigration lot aren't going to be best pleased when they realise they have been conned).

... Just hope our duplicitous representatives with no fekking plan in place manage to achieve it. "Germany will still want to sell their cars, France their wine; the EU needs us more than we need them ..." etc. But how much do we import from Luxembourg? Slovenia? Latvia? etc They also get a vote on this. Germany will need to do lots of horse trading with more concessions to the 'minnows' And we will end up with our hopeful faces pressed against the window.

As before though Article 50 has not yet being invoked...and the EU is apparently backtracking on the pressure to act immediately. It seems nobody is in a hurry to start this

Just one last bit from me....found this on t'internet. Don't you just wish more voices like this had been heard during this horribly divisive campaign. Facts and facts only.

Bit of a choppy ride on the markets on Friday. Best advice I can give is sit on your hands and ride out this inevitable period of uncertainty while keeping an eye out for one or two genuine long term bargains. The Pound fell sharply against all major currencies. Many UK listed multinationals generate profits and pay dividends denominated in US dollars so a weaker Pound will tend to have a positive effect on them (e.g. my BAT shares shot up 133p and I’ll get a bigger divi next time). Moody’s have put the UK’s (very important in trade negotiations) credit rating on negative watch but the BoE has a £250Bn contingency fund in case there’s a liquidity crunch. We import about 40% to 50% of our food so supermarket prices will be going up soon along with petrol, diesel and all other imported goods and probably domestic gas prices as well. We “pensioners” should be largely insulated from those effects because they’ll show up in the inflation figures via which our pensions are indexed ; it's workers on low wages who will take the biggest hit because they spend the greater part of their income on the essentials.
Foreign holidays and currency will be dearer too of course. Will the EHIC system still work post Brexit or is the cost of travel insurance for Europe about to rocket ? What about flight delay/cancellation rules ?

Personally I’d have preferred to stay in. I think it’s a shame we didn’t decide to stay and use our hard won privileged member status (which the EU has now revoked – which presents some short term risks in itself because it insulated us in some ways) and the power of our veto to press for reform (which I think is coming anyway). As a nation we don’t usually run away from a battle, especially one of principle, but this time we have. So be it. On a purely philosophical note I’m saddened that we’re distancing ourselves from other great nations with cultures, beliefs and values the most similar to our own.

A referendum is not legally binding of course. In a Swiss referendum a few years back the Swiss govt. overturned the result. Enabling the initiation of Article 50 will require an Act of Parliament to be passed by a majority of MPs, essentially to convert the non-binding referendum result into a statutory instrument by a majority vote of our MPs. I think an overturn by Parliament is an unlikely scenario here although it is technically possible . The majority of MPs are in favour of IN and Mr. Cameron would have known that when he set the date and so would Mr. Johnson of course. Thus the prevarication by OUT is interesting but I’d be wary of reading too much into it. The EU is trying hard to force the issue but has absolutely no executive power to do so, all they can do is stand on the touchline and shout ; the timing of the triggering of Article 50 is entirely in the hands of the leaving state.
Meanwhile we’re still full EU members with all our trade deals and our EU rights and our veto intact. Politics is a very dirty, very devious game and no doubt there’s an awful lot of horse trading going on in the smoked filled rooms both in Westminster and in Brussels.
However there is a very real possibility of the Tories calling a General Election with the Labour party being in such disarray at the moment. That could set the moggie amongst the magpies in all sorts of ways.
A pro-NHS non-partisan pressure group called 38 Degrees North (with which I have some association) has challenged OUT to categorically promise they will build a new hospital every week as per their campaign claims. Chickens are starting to wing their way home to roost.

But political speculation aside, coming out will by no means be the utter catastrophe the IN crowd have been claiming it will be. But neither is it the “glorious new opportunity” or “independence day” the OUT crowd claim that it will be. No nation is truly independent these days ; cut off our food imports and we’ll starve to death, cut off our oil and gas and the nation literally grinds to a halt. Some EU derived laws may or may not be revoked (will we scrap VAT on domestic energy ? not ruddy likely !) , we may or may not get a decent trade deal with the remaining 27 EU states which may or may not include free movement and a contribution to the EU pot. Personally I reckon any trade deal will still be subject to free movement and possibly a Norway style “membership fee” and it’s obviously got to be subject to EU regulations on goods and services. Result : little or no change, probably an overall negative. The 53 non-EU countries with whom the EU has a bloc trade agreement for us be each individually subject to WTO rules instead until we’ve negotiated the terms of each one individually . But of course they’ll soon come under intense pressure from the EU – a much, much bigger trading bloc with far more clout than us - to not give us a trade advantage over the EU. Result : little or no change, probably an overall negative. Whether any firms will move out of the UK and/or reduce their investment here (= cut jobs) remains an open question, odds on they’re sitting on their hands until the dust has settled before making that decision. But there are rumours a few banks have that in mind. Financial Services account for about 20% of our entire GDP and it is technically possible for the EU to what in effect amounts to revoking the UK banking system’s Euro trading license as a non-EU state. What about Scotland ? Suppose Scotland leaves the Union and joins/remains in the EU. That’ll open up a right old can of worms not least because we’d presumably need “Passport to Pimlico” (or in this case Peebles !) style border controls to prevent “free movement” EU migrants and illegals entering England and Wales ! Indeed one could argue that we now have that potential scenario from the Irish Republic via the Northern Ireland border. The Mayor of Calais is calling for our Border Service to be removed from French soil. They only have to give us , I think I’m right in saying, 1 month’s notice and the gates would be unlocked.

Pandora’s Box has been more than just opened ; the lid has been ruddy well blown off !
But when the last faint echoes of all the distortions, unsupported speculation and hollow rhetoric voiced by both camps have finally faded into the ether and we get back to dealing with facts will then dawn the painful realisation that whilst much has changed on the surface little will really have changed. The Emperor will simply have a new set of clothes.

It is not a reluctance to give official notice to leave the EU. It was made clear during the campaign that the prefered option, were the country to vote for Brexit, would be to have a period of reflection to get organised before official negotiations begin. During this time some unofficial soundings could be made with the leaders of other EU countries to ensure that time is not wasted once the official talks begin. It will also allow emotions to calm down a little and sense to take over. This is a sensible approach and one that the leaders like Frau Merkel agree with. It is only the EU Bureaucrats who are foot stamping as they see their powers about to decline.




What is happening is only a disaster for those Remainers that are sore losers. There cannot be many people who hadn't anticipated a period of unstability in the circumstances which have been made worse by an apparent refusal on the part of some Remainers to accept democracy and an unlikely change of leadership of both the two main political parties at the same time. Markets do not like uncertaincy so once things settle down we will see a bounce back which will be all the stronger if friendly ground rules are laid down by both sides in the forthcoming negotiations.

There have been some positive stuff coming out of Germany with Matthias Wissmann the leader of their automotive industry he said [i'Even if many "experts" are competing to paint the worst possible senario, now is the time for calmness. Every possible measure must be undertaken to enable the continued free movement of goods and services between the UK and other EU countries. Following the British departure from the EU, it will be in nobody's interest to make international flow of goods more expensive by erecting customs barriers between Britain and the European continent'[/i

Germany sells more cars to Britain than any other country, with 810,000 exported last year, Mr Wissmann said and half of the 2.6 million cars made in Britain last year were built by German owned fiorms such as BMW which runs Mini and Roll-Royce.

EON which is based in Dusseldorf is also lobbying against new customs barriers and their CEO said 'as fat as possible EU leaders should aim to retain a single market for goods and services for the British.

Frau Merkel has said there is 'no need to be nasty' in Britain's exit negotiations. The German Finance Ministry has prepared a document saying it is possible to reach an ageement where the UK is an 'associate member of associate partner status with the EU.

Business will be pragmatic and not emotional and I trust so will the leaders for the 27 other countries.



I think after such a bumpy campaign leaders of both sides were understandable exhausted, so do not put much value on how they have looked over the last few days. Neither should you overvalue hwta the unelected Eurocrats have to say. There are suggestions from within the EU that one of the reforms to consider is to transfer the Commissioners power to the EU parliament. Pity they did not listen earlier to the UK arguments for EU reform as it is obvious that the public throughout the EU has similar concerns to the British Brexiters. Nice to see we still have leadership qualities.

There is not a reluctance to give official notice to leave the EU. It was made clear during the campaign that the prefered option should the country vote for Brexit was for a period where

Does this mean we are out of Eurovision as well?

might as well be for all the votes we get!

Nothing at all to say on the complete dialling back of the two main Leave campaign promises? There will be no 350 million quid a week for the NHS - that apparently was a 'mistake,' and there'll be no end to free movement of labour - that, apparently, was never the case.

What exactly did most Leave supporters vote for?!

I work in construction & higher education. Both are unanimous - it is disastrous.



Really? So the markets are affected by people being upset at being lied to? Not just the Remainers though is it?



Really? Stevie Wonder could see the likely outcome.



How long will this be? You must know.

Too early to make any judgements on what will happen in reality. Until we are finally out of the EU, which will take at least 2 years, then we will not know what is possible or not possible and that will depend on the circumstances of our negotiations and our economy at the time. That is what I thought apparent.



The majority voted to leave the EU. That was the only question on the voting paper and there was no manifesto or further obligation.