Mid way through the first half when we'd been struggling for field position and possession he threw a speculative offload on his own 40, which Webb (?) knocked on.

At the scrum, Sinfield pulled him to one side and had a quiet word in his ear - I suspect about being more selective where and when he tries to throw miracle passes.

All part of the learning experience.

We'll have him!

Young Watkins missed 4 tackles and is being vilified.

Buderus missed 4 tackles. I am struggling to find any criticism of him, other than one sage like poster criticising a fall off in his usually solid tackling.

How sage does one have to be to comment on a tackle stat produced by Opta? Not very would be my guess.

You've reviewed the game, yes?

Care to highlight the four Buderus missed tackles during the game that have caused you to comment specifically on that aspect this week?

Or specifically comment on a chase (after a loose St Helens offload) and one on one follow up tackle on Wellens, gaining Leeds 15 meters respite and his potentially try saving one on one tackle on Gaskell hitting a gap two tackles later. Perhaps being unable to prevent the Roby offload that followed counts as a missed tackle at Opta (I've no idea) but it was a commendable double tackle effort which unfortunately on this occasion was not backed up by Leeds' right side defence where Hardaker left his wing exposed after Watkins (quite unusually for him) was sliding out to cover Meli, allowing Foster a walk-in.

And then there was the try saving cover tackle (assisted by Hall) after Lomax had skinned Clarkson and turned Webb inside out just before the interval. Last week you were all over Watkins like a rash for a similar try saving effort, not so with Buderus this week.

At the same time you may care (or not) acknowledge the quality of his dummy half pass to Sinfield that helped create the opportunity for Leeds' opening try to Hall. Which other dummy half in SL would be capable of making that pressurised pass so close to the try and defensive line? Not many I'd suggest, not even at Bradford.

PMSL

Yes. I witnessed Buderus fall off a number of tackles.

I have no desire to comment upon the other issues you raise in your post because I merely observed that Buderus missed the same amount of tackles as Watkins however your desperation to defend those misses with reference to other aspects of the game is duly noted.

DO you not think that Buderus missed 4 tackles? I do. Do you also have reason to doubt the accuracy of the missed tackle quota for Watkins or is it accurate for young English players making mistakes?

I am not in the slightest bit shocked that by simply daring to highlight the statistics show the two players have the same number of misses it's brought such an impassioned defence of the ageing, quota occupying, expensive Aussie and such criticism for the young, English player.

I have to wonder if Broughton would be the apple of your eye if he were in our first team making mistakes.

i agree, your comments seem to echo a wayne bennett quote about blooding academy prospects from a few years ago.

I think you've made your point more constructive here than in your OP tbh, in fact you've almost summed his situation up perfectly.....at present

IMO defense is all about team coached structures and how a player is required to defend within these structures.

We've now got a new coach at our club who is clearly re-structuring our defensive patterns/structures have we not?

So to pin the blame on individual players is wrong IMO, Either our players will learn to deal succesfully with these coach driven structures, or these structures arn't any good

Watkins can tackle,as proved by his 2 try saving tackles against Salford, but the thing he is struggling with at present and which sides are clearly targeting him with is his reading of the oppositions play, he seems to be more concerned with ball watching than reading the lines run by players.

This will only be remedied with experience, but he's got to be in these situations week to week in order to learn?

A regular wing partnership down that side of the field would obviously help him/them to get some defensive discipline out wide, but this hasn't happened as of yet due to injuries, he has subsequently had 3 different wing partners in the past 5 games, and was only a sub in game 1

I still have faith in Kallum Watkins

Don't be so silly

...but Senior wouldn't allow it.

You're right though of course.

Get Senior at right centre ( until BJB is fit again ) to partner Smith ( in the unfortunate Hardaker's absence ).
If he doesn't like it .....stick him in the pack.

Any specific examples you'd like to discuss further? I still have the game on Sky and will be happy to join in the debate as to their relevance to his overall performance and/or outcome of the match. For example were any of these missed tackles turning points/momentum shifters?

Failing that I would also like to offer a general observation just as you have done above. Leeds' current problems don't start with Buderus. He still performs at a level most of his team-mates will never achieve.



Noted also that you have no desire to discuss contributions to an overall performance that could be construed as positives, preferring to focus on an, as yet, un-verified negative.

Which missed tackles am I defending? Will you be highlighting when they occurred during Saturday's game? Perhaps then I will defend them - or perhaps I won't defend them - it all depends on whether they had an impact on the play, whether he was supported by his team-mates or hung out to dry, that type of thing. Point them out and we'll take it from there shall we?



I didn't bring up the number of missed tackles either player made on this thread (that would be your goodself) or elsewhere as far as I am aware (I'm sure you'll correct me if I'm wrong), although I did repeat my concerns with regards Watkin's game generally and tackling only forms part of that observation. As this was a thread discussing his performance on the weekend perhaps I'll be allowed some latitude to do so on this occasion. Age and nationalilty are irrelevant to me when appraising individual performances. I highlighted that for once Watkins was in slide defence (and that is progress) only for Hardaker to commit to the wrong man for St Helens opening score. Was there anything more to take encouragment from?



Such criticism by who? A comparison of how they performed in all aspects of the game would be a more balanced approach rather than fixating on one (as yet) poorly defined statistic.



PS, His performances (good and bad) I imagine would be discussed by those interested enough to do so on this forum and that doesn't even require him to play for Leeds.

Whether you agree with tvoc or not, you have to admit he puts a very eloquent argument forward. I enjoy reading your posts old boy, keep it up!!!

Sadly I don't. Can I just clarify before we go any further, do you think that Buderus didn't miss 4 tacklesm or any tackles in last weekends game?

Slurp.