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| Don't really care about England RU and eligibility rules, but for me if you aren't born in England you can't play for England. What is the point of international rugby / sport? And if you've already played for another nation, how on earth can you play for a different nation?
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| So what if your parents emigrate when you're a kid, and you grow up with an attachment to your new home country? Should you be denied the opportunity to represent it just because you were born somewhere else?
Or someone who comes to Britain as a refugee, like say Mo Farah or Luol Deng? I'm sure they consider themselves to be as British as anyone born here.
The global population is much more mobile these days. A larger percentage of people are living in and growing up with an attachment to a country other than the one they were born in. Sporting eligibility rules need to reflect that.
I'm no fan however of people switching from one country to the other. Once you've decided which country you want to represent, stick with it.
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| Atkins has played well this season and would be worthy of a spit there's a out if rugby to be played yet and I'm.sure centres a position.that's still up for grabs.
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| If Hodgkinson gets picked over Gale then its an absolute disgrace, and show that SL is basically pointless
Gale is tearing it up in SL, Hodkinson is struggling in NRL
As for the Morris twin, they have both played for australia and therefore would play for australia if picked
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| Quote Superted="Superted"Or Ben Te'O, Dylan Hartley, Tuilagi, the Vunipolas, Yarde, Harrison, Clifford from the more recent England RU squads.... That's at least 8 players in the squad who were not born and raised in England... Many with foreign accents...
I don't particularly like it, but that's modern day sport - and a reflection really of modern day life.
The Aussie and Kiwi RL teams do it, we've previously done it, so basically, we might as well join them, or be left further behind.... Pick the best players who are available and committed to the cause...'"
There is a HUGE difference that you are forgetting
In the case of nearly all RU international teams, you have to PLAY in that country to be eligible (the major hold out being SA)
That means that any players from Aus or NZ who play for England in RU have officially given up their chance to play for their country anyway
In RL however Hodkinson or the Morris brothers could still be picked for Aus and we might get the embarrassing situation where a player pulls out of the Aus camp and they take someone that has said they wanted to play for us!
That is the big difference why I support picking Cuthbo and not these guys
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Player Coach | 8895 | Leeds Rhinos |
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| Born here or qualify through residency for me. Although the not identifying with the team argument tends to fall down when you see how much one club mentality exists between RL supporters generally.
It doesn't work that way in RU, although some unions insist on international players actually playing in their home country (which I tend not to agree with).
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| There's no chance the Morris brothers would be eligible or willing to play for England. They are both still in the Origin frame and also possibly Australia (although down the pecking order now). I wouldn't have a problem with Hodkinson as he hasn't played for Australia. If he wants to play I also wouldn't bet against him and Widdopp being first choice halfbacks because they at least offer control and kicking games.
I'd be surprised if a few others don't come out of the woodwork under Bennett, but most of the pack will be English.
In any event what seems small time to me is the hand-wringing that goes on whenever the very idea is mentioned. Nothing screams little-Englander flat cap mentality more than insisting that England RL should not even apply the same rules as other sports have for years.
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| Quote BrisbaneRhino="BrisbaneRhino"There's no chance the Morris brothers would be eligible or willing to play for England. They are both still in the Origin frame and also possibly Australia (although down the pecking order now). I wouldn't have a problem with Hodkinson as he hasn't played for Australia. If he wants to play I also wouldn't bet against him and Widdopp being first choice halfbacks because they at least offer control and kicking games.
I'd be surprised if a few others don't come out of the woodwork under Bennett, but most of the pack will be English.
In any event what seems small time to me is the hand-wringing that goes on whenever the very idea is mentioned. Nothing screams little-Englander flat cap mentality more than insisting that England RL should not even apply the same rules as other sports have for years.'"
If Hodkinson is picked over Gale (or even Matty Smith for that matter!) I will not be watching
He is playing worse that a lot of Halfbacks in SL, he would only be picked on the grounds he was an NRL player, as there are plenty of Aussies who believe that virtually EVERY player in the NRL is better than virtually every player in SL
RL has different rules to virtually EVERY other sports
In MOST sports you can only play for one country
What people fear is you will get Aussies like Hodkinson who will probably not play origin again, never mind australia, who decide that they will play for England for a payday
If we play as the Aussie B team we will never beat them, thats just logic
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| Quote Andy Gilder="Andy Gilder"So what if your parents emigrate when you're a kid, and you grow up with an attachment to your new home country? Should you be denied the opportunity to represent it just because you were born somewhere else?
Or someone who comes to Britain as a refugee, like say Mo Farah or Luol Deng? I'm sure they consider themselves to be as British as anyone born here.
The global population is much more mobile these days. A larger percentage of people are living in and growing up with an attachment to a country other than the one they were born in. Sporting eligibility rules need to reflect that.
I'm no fan however of people switching from one country to the other. Once you've decided which country you want to represent, stick with it.'"
To answer your opening question. Yes. If you are born in England and emigrate to Oz, you're English. The whole point of international sport is one country competing against another.
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| In 'MOST' sports there are eligibility and qualifying rules very similar to those in RL. Residency has been used a number of times for RU players who have played for one country to become eligible for another. There's even a helpful listing on Wikipedia. Not to mention could you get any less 'English' than Hape or Vainakolo?
In any event, who is actually suggesting someone who has played for Australia would be picked for England? The Morris twins won't be eligible never mind wanting to play for England, so who is being suggested in that vein? TBH I'm so desperate for England to compete that I wouldn't have a problem if they did, but I can't see it happen.
If Hodkinson wants to put up his hand he should be considered on merit, not because of his accent. He hasn't played for Australia. Doesn't mean Bennett will pick him. But no matter how bad his form, he at least has been playing in the NRL. That should and will be a major factor in Bennett's choice of team because the NRL is a higher standard. It really is that simple.
Suggestions of Bennett picking Australia B are hysterical cobblers. Most if not all of the pack will be genuine Englishmen by even the most inward-looking standards (if fit Burgess x 3, Graham, Hodgson, Whitehead and Cooper from the NRL) plus most of the backs. All I reckon we'll see is one or two players we might not be aware of putting their hands up for England. Bennett is huge on team unity, so the idea that he'll be trawling the NRL for a multitude of hacks and has-beens is ridiculous.
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| Quote Stevosfalseteeth="Stevosfalseteeth"Quote Stevosfalseteeth="Andy Gilder"So what if your parents emigrate when you're a kid, and you grow up with an attachment to your new home country? Should you be denied the opportunity to represent it just because you were born somewhere else?
Or someone who comes to Britain as a refugee, like say Mo Farah or Luol Deng? I'm sure they consider themselves to be as British as anyone born here.
The global population is much more mobile these days. A larger percentage of people are living in and growing up with an attachment to a country other than the one they were born in. Sporting eligibility rules need to reflect that.
I'm no fan however of people switching from one country to the other. Once you've decided which country you want to represent, stick with it.'"
To answer your opening question. Yes. If you are born in England and emigrate to Oz, you're English. The whole point of international sport is one country competing against another.'"
That's not actually the case - there have been times when certain countries (England included) have done this, but certainly Aus, NZ and SA don't do this anymore - they realised they were holding their players back and more importantly losing their best players from the international game, just to protect their own domestic competitions - it was never really about eligibility for the National sides.
In today's world, there needs to be things in place to allow free movement around the globe, and I'm quite happy with players choosing between their place of birth, adoptive country or even heritage country if it means that much to them - but I do feel there should be a 'pick and stick' rule to stop swapping around - but then that will make the weaker nations even weaker.
So maybe we should stick with tier 1 and tier 2 Countries, and players can be eligible for 1 tier 1, and 1 tier 2 Nation - that they can jump between - might as well get rid of the rules around number of years between switching allegiance.... That way if Anthony Milford as an example gets picked for Aus, he can play for them and earn the money on offer, if he isn't picked, or Somoa have a game when Aus don't, he can still play for them and make their team stronger, whilst getting the feeling of 'representing his family'....
It's a fine balancing act between having decent eligibility rules so that the essence of International fixtures isn't lost, and keeping the better players available for the smaller Nations so that they can remain competitive and build for a stronger International game.
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| Wow, some real mixed views on here. I believe that once your capped for a country, you then shouldn't be allowed to change, in that sense I wouldn't have a problem with Hodkinson, but the Morris twins are a no. How are they even potentially eligible, were they born over here when Steve was at Leeds?
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