Sorry but seen two posts now. Sutcliffe had a great game, and Burrow our best attacker.

What are people watching? They were both poor. Sutcliffe at least though won us the game, despite his overall performance.

Parcell was easily our best attacker, our only attacking threat.

As a whole we were awful, absolutely awful. That performance wouldn't have been excusable against a Wigan or Warrington, so why are some trying to justify it against an injury hit championship side.

All it did is highlight just how poor some of the players in our squad are. When this is mixed with poor tactics there is nowhere to hide for those players. Some players however did stand up and put massive efforts in, and as I said earlier Sutcliffe as poor as he is st stand off, won us that game. Without that it would have been a loss.

I'd love to know how many times our winger have touched the ball in the last 2 games when not scooting. They'd might as well be playing union. Last season we were shocking and people said McD deserved another year, well it doesn't look like anything will change. The pack and just up and downers with now flair and struggle to break the line. Half backs struggle to move the ball.

Also, Stevie Ward not MOM? Stevie Ward not a good game? What the hell again are they watching.

50 tackles, no misses. People cream their pants when JJB gets close to that and misses half a dozen tackles, but a player returning from injury puts his body on line none stop and it's questioned. The guy was phenomenal defensively, making up for others around him.

I think we are going to have to be patient with Leeds this season. 2016 was so bad it is going to take more than a solid pre-season to get back to top 4 form. Despite the opening 10 minutes and the poor attacking performance in the second half, there were signs of improvement from last week.

A key moment of weakness that was uncharacteristic of the Saints game was the decision to take an unnecessary 2 points when Leigh were down to 12 men. For me, this just showed Leigh too much respect when we should have gone for the jugular. Presumably someone thought we were gassed at this point? We could and should have gone on to put the game beyond reach at this point - ghosts of low confidence/anxiety from last season / last week?

Overall positives: the willingness to work hard in defence, and more attacking enterprise (at times!).

Individual performances: some players looked more like their former selves, including Cuthbertson, Ablett, and at times Briscoe and Hall. Keinhorst made some crucial plays, and I thought Singleton is starting to look the part as a future pack leader. Golding continues to look solid defensively. Parcell looks like a good signing, certainly better than Falloon and potentially as good as/better than Aiton.

The situation at half-back is clearly a work in progress, to put it kindly. Sutcliffe is a bit of an enigma. I thought he looked more threatening in attack, and made two crucial plays in getting the drop goal and 40:20. He doesn't look like a confident stand-off yet, but if he's given time here I still wouldn't rule him out coming good later... The guy has been moved from pillar to post - told he was Zak Hardaker's replacement at FB in 2016 (no pressure there either!) and now thrust back into the halves to be the next Sinfield! To an extent this is a player management issue (BMD), but we simply can't expect him to sparkle instantly after being moved around so much.

If anything, Burrow deserves more flak than Sutcliffe - Burrow is a veteran now who should be able to kick the ball better than the majority of his efforts last night. McGuire steadied the ship at times, and despite a muted return, I think he needs a little more patience before being written-off just yet.

Otherwise, agree Mullally still has a lot to prove. I thought Ormondroyd produced a couple of strong carries and might shine if given a bit more game-time. Looking forward to the returns of Ferres, Moon, Garbutt, Galloway and Lilley.

Seriously Exeter, you think we would have still won that game had we not gone for two? I definitely do not.

That was the only time in the game besides Sutcliffes two moments that we showed good game management. Time and again we lost last year by not taking the two, last week we lost by not taking the two, last night we won taking the two. That decision is the last one I would moan about from last night. Bud had we not took it and lost, I along with many others would certainly have been moaning about it.

Couple of interesting stats on the SL website, as well as stuff I've noticed watching the game back.

First on Mullaly, who has made eight carries across two games. I know his game time is limited, but that's Kirke esque, not good solid packman Kirke either, the last few years Kirke.

Walters who I know gets some stick on here managed 29 tackles, with no misses (maybe take that with a pinch of salt). As well as 6 carries. Also earnt the penalty we kicked in the 2nd half.

Ward and Singo really stand out has having started the season well, both high in the tackle and carry count. It was Singo who scattered the defenders for Parcell to jump out for Halls try. I think this is the year he makes himself an undisputed starting prop for us.

From an outsider point of view I dont take that comment of Sutcliffe being poor. Yes you see him week in week out for me he isn't a 6 in a month of sundays. But he is big strong and pokes his nose through everytime. I think as a wide running second row or centre he could be lethal, dpendant on his defensive abilities which like I say I cant comment on

Totally agree with Gotcha wrt taking the 2 especially when we are showing very little threat in the opponents 20m especially when they are all stood in a static line.
Thus far our defence has been good but overall i see very few lessons learned from last year irrespective of who the HB's are.

somebody mentioned the other day about our props being a weakness. boy was he right. we have 2 half decent ones in cuthbertson and Galloway and the rest of the experienced ones are championship level. garbage. the only yards we make are with the 2nd rows/backs and they are dominated throughout the game.
i'd go so far as to say we have about the worst set of props in the division, with maybe leigh.
pay peanuts you get monkeys

Garbutt?

I'm hopeful Baldwinson and Ormandroyd can step up, but I agree they are going to have to do it sooner rather than later, especially with Galloway out.

I thought Ward went well, though not MOM - a monumental defensive effort, and plenty of his tackles have a bit of 'sting' in them.

Cuthbertson went well and Parcell looks the business. His distribution is very smooth and reliable, defence is good and the only consistent threat in attack we have are his scoots from a quick ptb.

Watkins looks half dangerous when given the ball with a bit of space, but for some reason he won't come looking for work and impose himself on a game, and the team criminally under use him. We'll really struggle against a team like Wigan or Warrington who'll kill the speed of the play the ball, and we have zero ideas how to create space once the defensive line is set.

Sutcliffe looks more and more like a free roaming, running loose - he certainly ain't a 6 or 7....

The big issue is we look like a team of absolute plodders - the forwards have plenty of effort, but they're all relatively slow and low impact. Other than Parcell, there is no point of difference.

Going for 2 was wrong in every way !

We needed field position
They were down to 12 men
It did not put us a further score in front
Sent out the wrong message
Was totally against what we had done earlier

Yet ultimately along with the DG won us the game so not quite wrong in every way!

Imo we are still trying to adjust to losing JP both in sharing the work rate & we miss an old school enforcer.
The likes of Mullally Ormanroyd & Baldwinson need longer minutes to give em any chance of adjusting & imo uts way too early & harsh to write either of them off.
Singleton does the tough stuff but isn't a line breaker Galloway is very much the same so Cuthbertson has to up his work which leaves less opportunity for his off-load game.
For me id put Ward back at 13 & give him the extra pivit role we al know he can play rather than the extra prop there.

Going for 2 did not cost us the game but had we not gone for it nobody has any idea how the game would have gone.
Sutcliffe's DG on the stroke of half-time was brilliant & his 40-20 kick took away any chance that Leigh had of winning the game.
For that he should be applauded.
What I constantly find irritating is when either of JJB or Ablett - who otherwise had excellent games - gives away stupid penalties through messing around at the PTB.
They just seem incapable of getting that out of their system.
Personally I thought we looked much better when McGuire came on, other than knocking on from a daft pass from JJB, (forced by their defence?) he had little chance in the second half due to our continual failure to hold on to the ball.
Finally,I fail to see how the ref didn't at least refer the Mitch Brown try to the video ref, looked like a clear case of obstruction to me.
At least we went home with 2 points.