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It is a good and balanced article from Will Greenwood and worth reading. Greenwood is an ex England centre but also a League fan who attended the Grand Final rather than the England game on the same day.

For him to mention the Watkins rumour indicates he thought there was something in it and the comment about Eastmond preparing to walk if Sam was selected at 12 rather suggests there was confusion over which position he wanted to play.

His transition has been very badly managed at both club and country level where he was put in an invidious position with his teammates. When you add this to being blamed for England's WC exit and the Euro immigrant crisis it was no wonder he became disillusioned with Union.

If Burgess indeed did approach Leeds this would indicate that the homesick aspect of his reason for leaving was not the main one.

rlhttps://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/sam-burgess/11978751/Sam-Burgess-return-to-league-is-damning-indictment-of-union.htmlrl

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Quote: Juan Cornetto "It is a good and balanced article from Will Greenwood and worth reading. Greenwood is an ex England centre but also a League fan who attended the Grand Final rather than the England game on the same day.

For him to mention the Watkins rumour indicates he thought there was something in it and the comment about Eastmond preparing to walk if Sam was selected at 12 rather suggests there was confusion over which position he wanted to play.

His transition has been very badly managed at both club and country level where he was put in an invidious position with his teammates. When you add this to being blamed for England's WC exit and the Euro immigrant crisis it was no wonder he became disillusioned with Union.

If Burgess indeed did approach Leeds this would indicate that the homesick aspect of his reason for leaving was not the main one.

rlhttps://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/sam-burgess/11978751/Sam-Burgess-return-to-league-is-damning-indictment-of-union.htmlrl'"


For a man so obviously in the loop as Greenwood is I'm astounded he didn't make some of this knowledge public at the time. After all, it's what he's paid to do these days.

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Quote: Clearwing "For a man so obviously in the loop as Greenwood is I'm astounded he didn't make some of this knowledge public at the time. After all, it's what he's paid to do these days.'"



Spot on. To allegedly know of it for 3 weeks and not say anything makes it doubtful to me.

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Quote: ThePrinter "Spot on. To allegedly know of it for 3 weeks and not say anything makes it doubtful to me.'"


Perhaps he was told in confidence and is a man of integrity?

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Quote: Juan Cornetto "If Burgess indeed did approach Leeds this would indicate that the homesick aspect of his reason for leaving was not the main one.'"


Well everybody knows the homesickness thing is a lie anyway. This is a guy who went to Australia and wasn't joined by his family for another 18 months-2 years so he knew full well what moving to the other side of the world away from them felt like. This occasion though he at least had his fiancée with him. I very much doubt he'd be feeling homesick if he'd have spent the last week celebrating a World Cup win and was being praised for his role in it.

Over time, the books and articles will be written by the main protagonists involved and we'll get to know exactly what happened behind the scenes.

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Quote: ThePrinter "Over time, the books and articles will be written by the main protagonists involved and we'll get to know exactly what happened behind the scenes.'"


I very much doubt that.

You're more likely to get three different versions of events (Ford/Bath, Lancaster/England Rugby, & Burgess). People will then have to decide which parts of each they believe most. And then the whole saga/debate will re-start......

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An interesting (& highly irritating) side point to this saga: the BBC, Sky etc's take on the latest events seems to be almost wholly from a Union standpoint/bias. Any number of ex-Union internationals/pundits have been trotted out to give their opinion. Have these national media outlets sought out the opinions of McNamara/Kear/McDermott/Eddie & Stevo etc etc? I have heard virtually no upbeat reporting on how great this is for RL. Equally, when the boot was on the other foot 12 months ago & Burgess was poached by Union (no difference in my eyes), lo & behold all the upbeat talk from the media on how great this was & Union pundits again are the only ones in sight.

I realise some may see this as a "chip on the shoulder" post, but really I do find the balance of reporting distorted

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Quote: son of headingley "I realise some may see this as a "chip on the shoulder" post, but really I do find the balance of reporting distorted'"


Not surprising - it is. Those of an enquiring mind may be persuaded to dig deeper though, as might the odd journo (although in my experience the sports ones have some of the least enquiring minds going).

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Their's comments from McNamara and Jon Wilkin in the BBC website. The angle the whole thing is taking now though isn't really blaming Burgess anymore, it's attacking England RU and they way they handled it and even former RU players and coaches coming out saying Burgess could've been great IF he'd been given time and RU have let a diamond slip out of their hands.

Clive Woodward has been pretty spot on in his views,

"The RFU has spent the last four years congratulating itself on the direction in which we're heading, but the truth is we have marched confidently into a total mess,"

"We are the laughing stock of not only world rugby but also sport and business. The rest of the world says those involved in English rugby are arrogant. I hate this reputation, but that is exactly what the RFU has been

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Quote: son of headingley " Any number of ex-Union internationals/pundits have been trotted out to give their opinion. Have these national media outlets sought out the opinions of Eddie & Stevo etc etc?'"


icon_eek.gif Please God know, not those two on BBC Breakfast as the voice of RL, we'd never live it down

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"Well, Eddie, as I see it Burgess should have tried a little chip over the top in the second stanza against Wales"

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"Well Sam isn't to blame for the loss against Wales. It's because the coach didn't get the message out not to give away any silly penalties!"

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The majority of this fiasco is down to Lancaster. It baffles me how he got the England job in the first place.
He had virtually no experience of coaching at the highest level.
England's only hope is to appoint Woodward as director of rugby, he will select a coaching team that should do justice to what seems a decent squad of players.

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Perhaps my use of Eddie & Stevo as "experts" was a little overstretching it!

"My wife will be furious when I get back to the sheds at half time"

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Quote: Backwoodsman "The majority of this fiasco is down to Lancaster. It baffles me how he got the England job in the first place.
He had virtually no experience of coaching at the highest level.
England's only hope is to appoint Woodward as director of rugby, he will select a coaching team that should do justice to what seems a decent squad of players.'"


Well they need to do something, if exiting their own Workd Cup at the group stage doesn't kick them up he backside nothing will.

Woodward is right, they are arrogant. They've gone along living off that success in 2003. Hell since then they've only won 1 of the next 12 Six Nations, that's pitiful for a team that is hyped like it is. Wales and France have won 4 each in that time and Ireland 3, all managing at least one or more Grand Slams in that time. In comparison England won 3 of the previous 4 Six Nations tournaments before that 2003 WC win.

They got battered by South Africa in the group stages of the 2007 WC and somehow by hook or by crook they dragged themselves into the final and it papered over the cracks. The 2011 WC was a disaster both on and off the field and they promised change yet when they got to 2015 they produced more embarrassment both on and off the field.

Their campaign and current status is very much similar to the cricketers. Both entered a World Cup in 2015, both were shown up to be playing an old school outdated style of the game that looked even more ridiclous compared to the attacking exciting style of its opposition. Questionable selection calls and a coach who whilst bigged up was massively lacking come crunch time.

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