FORUMS > Leeds Rhinos > Lenighan blames West Yorkshire mafia |
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| The Warning bells have been ringing for years. The fact that so few clubs in SL are thought of as financially stable should be a major cause for concern for those who follow this great game, including those that follow "sucessful" clubs. We struggle (and fail?) to maintain a truely competative 12 team comp, both on and more importantly off the field, Whilst I'm sure that many who don't follow Leeds will take a degree of schadenfreude from our performances this season and fair play to them. There is no joy for me in seeing clubs like Salford or Wakey struugle on the financial front. If we think the game is struggling now, imagine it if there were only 4 or 5 viable top flight clubs. Our failure to generate a truely competative world cup or international competition has, IMO, damaged the sport financially in the Norther hemisphere. If we can not pull together a sustainable model for top flight RL over here then we are doomed to a slow decline into total obscurity. We need strong collabrative leadership at club and RFL level and please god, a decent strategic plan.
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| Quote: The Ghost of '99 "The reserve team I agree on, not because Hetherington's approach is wrong in practice but because of the destructive effect it has on the league below in using dual reg for a de facto reserve teams.
But the excuses being made that the 8s is the root of all problems is laughable. Is it too much jeopardy for too many SL teams? Possibly. But it's enlivened that end of the table and the championship. On the other hand the short notice of fixtures is a definite challenge so it has its weaknesses. But changing format isn't going to suddenly make viable all those clubs which aren't viable. Grasping a bit more money at the same time would have, slightly, but that seems to have been fought off.
Going all in to save the 8s is probably not what I'd have bothered with if I were running Leeds as, frankly, it doesn't really make much difference to the end of the table we generally swim in. But standing up for the interests of the rest of the game is something I do applaud Hetherington for.'"
The 8s may not be the root of problems but are a major concern. Attendances at matches and viewing figures are woeful. The system has obviously not enlivened things up as if it had it would be reflected in the attendances and viewing figures.. If they continue will have very adverse effect for negotiations for TV rights next time around. Clubs don't like the system, fans don't like the system so why continue with it.
If you believe Hetherington was standing up for the rest of the game in an altruistic way and should be applauded you must be very gullible. He was trying to stir things up purely to serve his own ends as he always does. He is always full of himself when putting forward his views but noticeably quiet when things go against him. The Fev Chairman was very considered in his response. Expressing his disappointment yet acknowledging the need to work together in the future. What was Hetherington's response? No comment he needed time to consider the situation. I wonder if the reporter managed to avoid the dummy?
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| If only a quick fix solution was available to cure the problem. The game at the moment is stagnant, boring and lacking any kind of appeal whatsoever. Phil Clarke the other night on sky said the championship clubs should have the money to them reduced. Because they had not improved or expanded the game. That may be the case ,but that accusation could apply to several super league clubs. Unfortunately I am in my late sixties, the only plus side is over the years I have been privileged to watch some superb players. Some of the games I have witnessed this season have taken boredom to the extreme. The number of talented players on view is minuscule.
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3076_1671446335.jpg SAINTS THE ORIGINAL AND PERENNIAL CHEATS
For sale full Saints kit (circa 1989). Shirts in pristine condition, but shorts badly soiled.
For 27 - 0 you get a trophy
For 75 - 0 you get sod all.
Wigan had eight in a row
Saints have five in a row:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_3076.jpg |
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| Quote: Backwoodsman "If only a quick fix solution was available to cure the problem. The game at the moment is stagnant, boring and lacking any kind of appeal whatsoever. Phil Clarke the other night on sky said the championship clubs should have the money to them reduced. Because they had not improved or expanded the game. That may be the case ,but that accusation could apply to several super league clubs. Unfortunately I am in my late sixties, the only plus side is over the years I have been privileged to watch some superb players. Some of the games I have witnessed this season have taken boredom to the extreme. The number of talented players on view is minuscule.'"
He didn't say that at all. What he asked was is that the best use of the money, questioning if it could be better used to support community clubs with the aim of increasing player participation.
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| I’m torn on this one.
I like the 8’s, it’s probably the only system that eliminates as many “meaningless” games as a system ever can do and it does breathe life into the bottom of the table and the top of the Championship.
However, I think it draws too many clubs into potential relegation. Leeds being a good example of this this season. A team finishing 9th in the season is having to delay signings and planning for next season and beyond because their future in SL isn’t certain. Now for a club like Leeds they can probably deal with that uncertainty for a year but smaller clubs who are in that position year on year must be struggling.
So whilst I’d prefer a licensed league, I prefer the new structure over the current one. I like the top 5 playoffs as well.
I don’t like the loop fixtures. I get clubs would struggle with only 11 home games but I’d rather expand the league than have extra games against the same teams. Personally I’d expand the league to either 16 or even 20 teams.
What I don’t like though is the squabbling and time and effort that has been put into this from elements of the sport when they should be finding ways of improving attendances, corporate sales, sponsorship and non-game day revenues instead of just blaming the RFL for all the game’s ills.
The structure of the league isn’t going to significantly improve the health of the league. Clubs improving their own infrastructure instead of spending all their money on players, will.
Personally I’d introduce a rule on the salary cap, either you can only spend a maximum of 25% of your clubs income on players wages, or 50% but discount the TV money from a clubs relevant income for the calculation.
That way a club would have to bring in around £4m a year of their own money before they can spend the full cap.
I get there are concerns about the size of our salary cap compared to the NRL and Union, but whilst their salary cap is much higher so are their revenues.
We need our clubs to grow their revenues before spending more on the same players.
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| Agree re repeat loop fixtures but there’s far from enough quality players to have 16-20 teams, not to mention them being viable businesses. 14 tops, though we’re scraping the barrel at 12!
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icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg Your job is to say to yourself on a job interview does the hiring manager likes me or not. If you aren't a particular manager's cup of tea, you haven't failed -- you've dodged a bullet.:icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg |
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| Quote: The Ghost of '99 "The reserve team I agree on, not because Hetherington's approach is wrong in practice but because of the destructive effect it has on the league below in using dual reg for a de facto reserve teams.
But the excuses being made that the 8s is the root of all problems is laughable. Is it too much jeopardy for too many SL teams? Possibly. But it's enlivened that end of the table and the championship. On the other hand the short notice of fixtures is a definite challenge so it has its weaknesses. But changing format isn't going to suddenly make viable all those clubs which aren't viable. Grasping a bit more money at the same time would have, slightly, but that seems to have been fought off.
Going all in to save the 8s is probably not what I'd have bothered with if I were running Leeds as, frankly, it doesn't really make much difference to the end of the table we generally swim in. But standing up for the interests of the rest of the game is something I do applaud Hetherington for.'"
This is where you I disagree - the best interest of the game is to generate as much external revenue as possible - this can only happen if the elite competition is of a standard that attracts suitable TV and external sponsorship. To do this we need to improve the quality on the field and increase participation neither of which the Championship really contribute towards.
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22575.gif "Brian McDermott, with a wry smile, nods when asked if he remembers a specific incident which made him realise he was a prick. 'I do', he murmurs.":22575.gif |
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| Quote: Sal Paradise "This is where you I disagree - the best interest of the game is to generate as much external revenue as possible - this can only happen if the elite competition is of a standard that attracts suitable TV and external sponsorship. To do this we need to improve the quality on the field and increase participation neither of which the Championship really contribute towards.'"
Destroying the championship clubs for relatively trivial amounts of money is not productive. The fans of those clubs are core rugby league consumers, who buy sky subscriptions, have kids who play the game and who go to big events like internationals or the grand final. The stuff coming out of the arrogant mouths of lie likes of Lenagan is pushing all those people away.
The game has ripped itself apart over money and arbitrary divisions for the past two decades. It isn't healthy and I strongly believe that those clubs who have been lucky enough to be at the top table when the music has stopped have no right to destroy the futures of clubs, many historically larger, who are not top flight right now.
Growing the game is essential. Not destroying the existing game and a large segment of the existing fan base is also essential.
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71261_1683968120.jpeg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_71261.jpeg |
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| Quote: The Ghost of '99 "Destroying the championship clubs for relatively trivial amounts of money is not productive. The fans of those clubs are core rugby league consumers, who buy sky subscriptions, have kids who play the game and who go to big events like internationals or the grand final. The stuff coming out of the arrogant mouths of lie likes of Lenagan is pushing all those people away.
The game has ripped itself apart over money and arbitrary divisions for the past two decades. It isn't healthy and I strongly believe that those clubs who have been lucky enough to be at the top table when the music has stopped have no right to destroy the futures of clubs, many historically larger, who are not top flight right now.
Growing the game is essential. Not destroying the existing game and a large segment of the existing fan base is also essential.'"
In what way are the championship clubs being destroyed. I understand the funding is to remain the same until the next tv deal is negotiated. What happens after that is in the air in any case.
Are you in Hetherington’s fan club by any chance?
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71261_1683968120.jpeg :d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_71261.jpeg |
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| Quote: The Ghost of '99 "Destroying the championship clubs for relatively trivial amounts of money is not productive. The fans of those clubs are core rugby league consumers, who buy sky subscriptions, have kids who play the game and who go to big events like internationals or the grand final. The stuff coming out of the arrogant mouths of lie likes of Lenagan is pushing all those people away.
The game has ripped itself apart over money and arbitrary divisions for the past two decades. It isn't healthy and I strongly believe that those clubs who have been lucky enough to be at the top table when the music has stopped have no right to destroy the futures of clubs, many historically larger, who are not top flight right now.
Growing the game is essential. Not destroying the existing game and a large segment of the existing fan base is also essential.'"
You say “I strongly believe that those clubs who have been lucky enough to be at the top table when the music has stopped have no right to destroy the futures of clubs.” They are not lucky! They are where they are due to hard work, development, investment and success on the field.
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icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg Your job is to say to yourself on a job interview does the hiring manager likes me or not. If you aren't a particular manager's cup of tea, you haven't failed -- you've dodged a bullet.:icons077e_files/5454-3678dentheman-msnicons.jpg |
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| Quote: The Ghost of '99 "Destroying the championship clubs for relatively trivial amounts of money is not productive. The fans of those clubs are core rugby league consumers, who buy sky subscriptions, have kids who play the game and who go to big events like internationals or the grand final. The stuff coming out of the arrogant mouths of lie likes of Lenagan is pushing all those people away.
The game has ripped itself apart over money and arbitrary divisions for the past two decades. It isn't healthy and I strongly believe that those clubs who have been lucky enough to be at the top table when the music has stopped have no right to destroy the futures of clubs, many historically larger, who are not top flight right now.
Growing the game is essential. Not destroying the existing game and a large segment of the existing fan base is also essential.'"
These clubs offer very little - their core support is pathetic given the legacy of many of these clubs - their facilities are - on the main - embarrassing I fail to see what investing in this sector actually brings that spending that amateur clubs would not. The numbers are so small the impact on Sky revenues would be minimal even if they all downed tools and quit SKY if some of these clubs were merged with others.
If Hunslet merged with Leeds do you really think the numbers of kids playing at Parkside would be diminished - kids play RL primarily because of peer pressure/need to be part of a gang.
The problem with the game is two fold: participation and the standard of the professional game - neither of which can be addressed by increased investment in the Championship and its clubs.
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| I've no strong views on the league structure, Seen 16 team playoffs through to 4 up, 4 down and everything in between , I suspect this current version will only last a few years.
Lenaghan, Elstone and co have their wish of ending super 8's - to help market games, draw in crowds and attract sponsors.
Just one minor issue, they have replaced it with loopy fixtures which they cannot yet explain who will play who and when. I suspect they will be very keen to manipulate this to help bring in coin - so expect a saints / Wigan game and hull Derby as 2 certain loopy games.
If wood or now rimmer had come up with a new structure that is not explainable to the fans, media, tv companies or sponsors they would have been rightly slaughtered by Lenaghan and co.
Pretty pathetic from Elstone and all the supposed genius business brains of the 11 SL clubs that they have agreed a new structure that is half baked.
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1157.jpg It's not how much talent you've got, it's what you do with it that counts.:1157.jpg |
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| What’s wrong with having a franchise structure where every 3 years any clubs can apply and be considered along with every other club? Why does someone have to drop out of the top division for someone else to be accommodated?
If it really is for monetary terms then those running the clubs and the game need to decide if they are doing it for he good of the game or for the good of themselves.
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| Quote: batleyrhino "What’s wrong with having a franchise structure where every 3 years any clubs can apply and be considered along with every other club? Why does someone have to drop out of the top division for someone else to be accommodated?
If it really is for monetary terms then those running the clubs and the game need to decide if they are doing it for he good of the game or for the good of themselves.'"
I agree. Franchise is the way to go. 14 teams inside next 2 years. Expand further if lower league clubs get the infrastructure right and have some money behind them.
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| Seems to me like we are going backwards. We used to have a twelve team league and then contrived extra fixtures . before that a 14 team league . All of these have been tried and then deemed as failures. No one coming up with any thing new . We have had a franchised system before , that didn`t work either.
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