It's been predicted by plenty on here ever since 2011.

This time though they may just be right.

no may just about it

If it comes across as harsh on the kids that's not my intention. I have no doubt everyone of them is slogging their guys out.

However, I maintain few of them are good enough at this level yet and it will be a while before they are. I think that is a fair comment and everything you would expect of kids coming through the ranks and been forced into making debuts earlier than ideal, playing more games than is ideal and not having enough old heads on the pitch with them to guide them.

The question is why are we in this position? Injuries is the simple answer but as tad says, the team is aging which makes injuries easier to pick up and longer to recover from. That then turns into the recruitment question.

Watkins
Myler
Peteru
Singleton
Garbutt
Ward
Goulding
Mullally
Lilley

Are not Old and are either just returning or currently injured.

Myler has been fit most of the season, but he has been decent
Peteru has barely played so harsh to judge either way
Goulding is a sub at best
Lilley is a dual reg only recalled because of the injury crisis
The other four I agree, first team players who all would have helped the team.

Interesting that despite missing multiple second rowers only ward is considered young

Wether you rate those players or not they have still been missing.

Second row is our weakest position but take JKBs work rate out and with a lack of forwards to take up the slack it’s difficult

It's pretty clear we aren't going to agree here and it's probably pretty dull for everyone else so let me leave it with this.

To avoid another disappointing season the club needs change. That might be a new coach or it might be a significant improvement in recruitment. If we don't have at least one I don't see how we make the top four.

Feel free to remind me of this in a little over a year.

I doubt it's dull for everyone theres been a similar thread running since 2011

That is not true. The critical problem has been the lack of big props for most of the season (not counting the need for quality 6 of course) For most of the season we have been without Garbutt, Peteru and a replacement for Galloway (who retired after the first few games) plus Cuthbertson has missed a lot and the Singleton has been on the sidelines.

Are you seeking to blame the older players for recent losses even when they are out injured? If you are referring to JJB and Ablett as your ageing second rowers then I beg to differ as they have played for much of the season when the big men were out and had to cover the middle defence carries and tackles and both have run their legs to water for the club and performed better than their younger replacements. Ward is every bit as injury prone as his older colleagues as is been Ferres and Sutcliffe.

Garbutt showed you the difference a big man makes which for almost the first time this year put us consistently on the front foot. Oledski especially has come on very very well indeed and is a totally different player to the one that started the season. Credit to the coach please.

Smith too has progressed well but still misses a lot of tackles and youngsters like Newman have to be allowed errors as they learn to play with the grown ups however these errors have been a factor in narrow losses which cannot be blamed on older experience players who have played such a key role in our success.

I am sure if we had had our first choices available all season like St Helens we would have been challenging them at the top of the table.

Glad to see i'm not a lone voice here

rubbish most of it too.
I'm ask again. why turn games into forward battles when you have no big men?
who decides tactics?
can't be BM as he's perfect according to you too.
and jjb and Ablett are shot. they simply havent thd legs and its obvious

This season we have had a major Injury crisis, that’s the reason we sit in 7th in the table

so have hull.
so have cas.
where are they in the table?

There’s just no rational debate on here it seems, no one has said BM is perfect, that’s a strawman, just because a couple of us don’t blame BM for absolutely everything and are looking at all the reasons for our poor form it doesn’t mean BM can do no wrong.