FORUMS > Leeds Rhinos > Segeyaro's tackle on Green |
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| Quote: BrisbaneRhino "Shoulder charges were part of the game for less than a decade. They were a thuggish form of 'tackling' requiring zero skill and endangering both players involved due to the complete lack of control. They were banned to avoid the sport being sued out of existence by ex-players, and will never return. I don't miss seeing players knocked senseless and commentators baying about great hits.'"
This is your opinion not mine ,you speak as if we should all listen as there is no other opinion other than yours.my opinion bring it back you were never allowed to shoulder charge the head any way so should never been banned,as i say let the players decide its there bodys giving or recieving it.if they keep it banned they have spoken, if they want it back they have spoken , ill respect any decison .
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| How were shoulder charges part of the game for less than a decade? They didn't start with Sonny Bill Williams, they've been around for as long as I've watched the game and been greatly appreciated from the terraces.
There was a real corker in the NRL this week but because it was delivered by the ball carrier it was completely ignored by the officials - there's a huge anomaly right there.
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| Quote: Andy Gilder "You might want to ask Luke Burgess about shoulder charges hardly ever hitting the head. Cost him a Wembley appearance IIRC.
The problem is that while shoulder charges hardly ever hit the head, the potential damage they can cause is much higher than an ordinary high tackle. It's as dangerous as a player using the elbow to the head, IMO.'"
Agree. The pic of Burgess's jaw split in half was horrible. Don't want my lad playing a game where any fuc*wit with no sense of his own safety can hurl himself like a meat torpedo at another player rather than actually attempting a genuine tackle.
Shoulder charge is dangerous and frankly not rugby. There is plenty of physicality in the game, perhaps we should be asking for more skill?
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| Quote: tvoc "How were shoulder charges part of the game for less than a decade? They didn't start with Sonny Bill Williams, they've been around for as long as I've watched the game and been greatly appreciated from the terraces.
There was a real corker in the NRL this week but because it was delivered by the ball carrier it was completely ignored by the officials - there's a huge anomaly right there.'"
You are told by coaches and when you learn the game that your shoulder should be the first point of contact in a tackle, I think the grey area is when that contact is big and it's hard to get arms involved . I don't see an issue with that, what had been banned is where the shoulder is the only intended point of contact. To me that's just an idiot trying to hurt someone.
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| Quote: DHM "Agree. The pic of Burgess's jaw split in half was horrible. Don't want my lad playing a game where any fuc*wit with no sense of his own safety can hurl himself like a meat torpedo at another player rather than actually attempting a genuine tackle.
Shoulder charge is dangerous and frankly not rugby. There is plenty of physicality in the game, perhaps we should be asking for more skill?'"
Simple way to solve it, any shoulder charges that make contact with the head or hit a player who has released the ball results in a 10 game ban
This would mean that shoulder charges would start and end with collisions by a tackler on someone of equal or greater size, which the fans want to see and belong in the game imo
What is bizarre to me is that the game is so worried about shoulder charges contacting the head but do little about high tackles, compared to union players league players can get away with murder, even with direct contact to the head excuses are offered like 'he was changing direction' or 'it was a reaction' when the tackler should be getting a minimum of a sin bin
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| THe current interpretation on shoulder charges seems quite sensible. You can hit just with your shoulder as long as youre not side on with no attempt to wrap your arm around.
Union's interpretation of the shoulder charge is much more severe. If you don't wrap your arms around its considered a shoulder charge. I've given penalties away and been binned for making a big tackle where the guy has flown backwards and I've not been able to get my arms around.
On danger, its dangerous for both the tackled player and the tackler. I shattered my collarbone into 5 pieces trying on 5 years ago, and it took a 6inch plate and 6 months out of the game to recover. Big collisions are good but the mechanics of a shoulder charge make it more likely to cause injury to either party
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| The shoulder charge was a legitimate form of 'big hit' that has been ruled illegal and now gone from the game and the spectacle of league IMO is subsequently diminished.
There was always an issue where the shoulder occasionally contacted the head of an opponent (SBW on Bai, Bailey on Fa'asavalu) and the sport took too long to address but now the solution has harmed the show.
If someone wants to put in the shot and gets it wrong then throw the book at him at the disciplinary.
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| Quote: tvoc "The shoulder charge was a legitimate form of 'big hit' that has been ruled illegal and now gone from the game and the spectacle of league IMO is subsequently diminished.
There was always an issue where the shoulder occasionally contacted the head of an opponent (SBW on Bai, Bailey on Fa'asavalu) and the sport took too long to address but now the solution has harmed the show.
If someone wants to put in the shot and gets it wrong then throw the book at him at the disciplinary.'"
Agreed. The sport misses the big hit as you say. Of course it can be harmful if done incorrectly but so can any tackle.
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| "The solution has harmed the show"?
There are still plenty of big hits in RL. The difference is, these are done with significantly less risk of serious injury to the tackler or ball carrier than a barely controlled shoulder charge presents.
If anyone can give me a memorable, legal example of a shoulder charge that stuck in their memory and didn't result in injury to one party or the other, go ahead.
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| Quote: tvoc "The shoulder charge was a legitimate form of 'big hit' that has been ruled illegal and now gone from the game and the spectacle of league IMO is subsequently diminished.
There was always an issue where the shoulder occasionally contacted the head of an opponent (SBW on Bai, Bailey on Fa'asavalu) and the sport took too long to address but now the solution has harmed the show.
If someone wants to put in the shot and gets it wrong then throw the book at him at the disciplinary.'"
Completely agree. My mate played in the academy with Singleton, and he's talked about when they played Wigan and Fielded was coming back from injury. Fielden ran it in and Singo sent him flying with a shoulder charge. My mate talks about how it lifted the Leeds team and gave them a boost. Done in that scenario, it's a brilliant part of the game. The issue was/is when players use them on people after they've passed the ball. I've been on the end of those and time out because of whiplash. We still see those tackles and there should be a hefty ban attached. This is a tough sport, but it seems to have softened over the years
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| Quote: Andy Gilder ""The solution has harmed the show"?
There are still plenty of big hits in RL. The difference is, these are done with significantly less risk of serious injury to the tackler or ball carrier than a barely controlled shoulder charge presents.
If anyone can give me a memorable, legal example of a shoulder charge that stuck in their memory and didn't result in injury to one party or the other, go ahead.'"
There are tons of examples Andy, Tube of You has plenty of quality compilations if you need evidence.
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| i agree with the ban. it crates needless danger to the player being tackled
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| Quote: tad rhino "i agree with the ban. it crates needless danger to the player being tackled'"
Fully agree. It is an injury waiting to happen and is totally unnecessary. I fail to see why this particular sort of GBH appeals to some rugby fans as so often in the past it was not a fair contest as the big bully chose to target talented small slight backs to try and injure them out of the game with the result the quality of the "show" was diminished.
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| It's the athletes and their ability to do what others simply couldn't that made league a game apart and still does but somewhat less so these days.
I'd be happy to let them decide what they are prepared to accept as part of the ongoing physical contest.
When asked what have they said?
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| Quote: Juan Cornetto "Fully agree. It is an injury waiting to happen and is totally unnecessary. I fail to see why this particular sort of GBH appeals to some rugby fans as so often in the past it was not a fair contest as the big bully chose to target talented small slight backs to try and injure them out of the game with the result the quality of the "show" was diminished.'"
Nobody wants to see the return of hitting halfbacks after they have released the ball, but the reality is that some teams still do it and get away with it by wrapping their arms around
The spectacle of the two packs battling however is as much a part of the spectacle as the speed and skill, the shoulder charge used to be a big part of that
It is also an effective way for little men to stop bigger men running at full tilt without giving away a quick ptb
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