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Quote: Ronzy "Whatever happened to the maxim that everyone, in this largely free country, is entitled to their opinion and to express that right in any way they see fit?

I've supported Leeds for the best part of thirty five years. In that time, I've seen sat through some absolute dross but, I'm still a paying customer and I will be until somebody nails the lid shut. However, I don't think it is my place or anyone else's for that matter, to criticise how other people exercise their freedom of expression.

Punters of any kind tend to vote with their feet, it really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone.'"


Apologies to all who have taken offence as I did not mean that you didn't have the right to criticise or comment on the current state of affairs.
Perhaps I mis worded my post.
The point I was trying to make was that IMO I think that any team which lost 4 key players and then suffered so many injuries to other 1st choice players would struggle to keep pace with the competition.

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"The Golden Generation finally has its Golden Fleece! They have Wembley Cup Final winners medals to add to their collection." 23/08/2014:



Quote: RHINO-MARK "Printer- 99% of the criticism is rellevant to the performances at that time did fans stop going?
No they didn't again the context has to be understood & at no point is it a p!$$ing contest into who the "real fans" are supposed to be.'"


Never said nobody wasn't real fans or that they stopped going.

But way too often people have overreacted to the slightest thing that didn't go well, it's the extremes of what people say I find ridiculous at times.

JAN 2015 - after the way the 2014 season ended with 5 league defeats and the playoff exit to Catalans, quite a lot of people were saying we had too many old players, our signings like Briscoe and Aiton were poor, guys like Hardaker can't do the basics like passing, players like Ward were used incorrectly as a workhorse 2nd row and we'd lucky to make top 4

Skip forward to APR 2016
Now people are saying any coach could've lead that group of players to a treble and that we should've dominated the league.

I mean come on which is it, either they were good enough to win a treble with any coach or they were too old/poor signings/unable to do basics/played incorrectly. It's one extreme to another.

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Quote: ThePrinter "Never said nobody wasn't real fans or that they stopped going.

But way too often people have overreacted to the slightest thing that didn't go well, it's the extremes of what people say I find ridiculous at times.

JAN 2015 - after the way the 2014 season ended with 5 league defeats and the playoff exit to Catalans, quite a lot of people were saying we had too many old players, our signings like Briscoe and Aiton were poor, guys like Hardaker can't do the basics like passing, players like Ward were used incorrectly as a workhorse 2nd row and we'd lucky to make top 4

Skip forward to APR 2016
Now people are saying any coach could've lead that group of players to a treble and that we should've dominated the league.

I mean come on which is it, either they were good enough to win a treble with any coach or they were too old/poor signings/unable to do basics/played incorrectly. It's one extreme to another.'"


I would suggest it is somewhere between the two - the basic skills of some Leeds players is embarrassing for a pro player.

You cannot look at Leeds in isolation you need to consider the competition as a whole. Were Leeds any better in 2015 than 2014 not sure I saw a huge improvement in standard in fact it could be argued they went backwards but not as fast as everyone else. So winning everything one year and not winning the GF the previous year does not prove your point either way.

It could be argued that both statements were in fact true.

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"He's the best coach I've had... His mix of man-management and his game plan is second to none. Since Brian Mac has been in charge, we've been in every final so far. I love playing for him. I can't praise him enough, I've so much respect for him and I hope he's here for a very long time." Kevin Sinfield 29/9/12:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_68506.jpg



The OP is very unfair.

Fair weather supporters support their team wholeheartedly when they are doing well.

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Quote: xparksider "Apologies to all who have taken offence as I did not mean that you didn't have the right to criticise or comment on the current state of affairs.
Perhaps I mis worded my post.
The point I was trying to make was that IMO I think that any team which lost 4 key players and then suffered so many injuries to other 1st choice players would struggle to keep pace with the competition.'"


It would if it were the only club suffering in that way - but virtually every club has a significant injury list.

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Quote: xparksider "Apologies to all who have taken offence as I did not mean that you didn't have the right to criticise or comment on the current state of affairs.
Perhaps I mis worded my post.
The point I was trying to make was that IMO I think that any team which lost 4 key players and then suffered so many injuries to other 1st choice players would struggle to keep pace with the competition.'"


Fair point

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Quote: Sal Paradise "It would if it were the only club suffering in that way - but virtually every club has a significant injury list.'"


Which clubs have suffered as badly as we have through missing players?

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Quote: Juan Cornetto "Which clubs have suffered as badly as we have through missing players?'"


Let's start with Wigan - they are missing there starting FB, starting HB, starting hooker plus a host of other players, Hull KR had as many missing as we did if not more, Cas had 10 out when they played Huddersfield. That is before you talk about Saints.

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Quote: Sal Paradise "Let's start with Wigan - they are missing there starting FB, starting HB, starting hooker plus a host of other players, Hull KR had as many missing as we did if not more, Cas had 10 out when they played Huddersfield. That is before you talk about Saints.'"


So which ones have been as badly affected as Leeds over the course of the season to date

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"The Golden Generation finally has its Golden Fleece! They have Wembley Cup Final winners medals to add to their collection." 23/08/2014:



Quote: Sal Paradise "I would suggest it is somewhere between the two - the basic skills of some Leeds players is embarrassing for a pro player.

You cannot look at Leeds in isolation you need to consider the competition as a whole. Were Leeds any better in 2015 than 2014 not sure I saw a huge improvement in standard in fact it could be argued they went backwards but not as fast as everyone else. So winning everything one year and not winning the GF the previous year does not prove your point either way.

It could be argued that both statements were in fact true.'"


No it couldn't unless you were one of the people saying both those things and trying to backtrack your way out how contradictory they are.

The suggestion that Leeds weren't really any better in 2015 than in 2014, perhaps even went backwards is not only a prime example of this, but quite ridiculous.

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[b:3e8ueqvz]I really am rhinoms and haven't stolen his Avatar![/b:3e8ueqvz]:d7dc4b20b2c2dd7b76ac6eac29d5604e_74805.gif



Quote: ThePrinter "Never said nobody wasn't real fans or that they stopped going.

But way too often people have overreacted to the slightest thing that didn't go well, it's the extremes of what people say I find ridiculous at times.

JAN 2015 - after the way the 2014 season ended with 5 league defeats and the playoff exit to Catalans, quite a lot of people were saying we had too many old players, our signings like Briscoe and Aiton were poor, guys like Hardaker can't do the basics like passing, players like Ward were used incorrectly as a workhorse 2nd row and we'd lucky to make top 4

Skip forward to APR 2016
Now people are saying any coach could've lead that group of players to a treble and that we should've dominated the league.

I mean come on which is it, either they were good enough to win a treble with any coach or they were too old/poor signings/unable to do basics/played incorrectly. It's one extreme to another.'"

I said neither but i do ? Where we currently are & i think the timing would be perfect to make more off/on field changes.
Also i always expected a tougher season this year it was obvious but i'll also say even with injuries/disruptions we should be performing better & adapted better in terms of shape etc.

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"The Golden Generation finally has its Golden Fleece! They have Wembley Cup Final winners medals to add to their collection." 23/08/2014:



Quote: RHINO-MARK "I said neither but i do ? Where we currently are & i think the timing would be perfect to make more off/on field changes.
Also i always expected a tougher season this year it was obvious but i'll also say even with injuries/disruptions we should be performing better & adapted better in terms of shape etc.'"


Yes I agree and why I said criticism was pretty fair for the current period we're going through. I think 6th/7th place with maybe a W5/L5 record would be understandable in the circumstances.

And the timing could well be perfect to make changes. The 'big' one being moving on from McDermott....which might/probably will happen. Should remember it's only the 2nd week in April, I don't recall the departures of Powell, Smith and McClennen being decided or announced this early.

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Quote: ThePrinter "Yes I agree and why I said criticism was pretty fair for the current period we're going through. I think 6th/7th place with maybe a W5/L5 record would be understandable in the circumstances.

And the timing could well be perfect to make changes. The 'big' one being moving on from McDermott....which might/probably will happen. Should remember it's only the 2nd week in April, I don't recall the departures of Powell, Smith and McClennen being decided or announced this early.'"

Not sure how early previous departures were decided prior to their oublic announcements tbh but its a fair point
Rumours and they are only rumours are that Mc.D will be moving on at the end of the season by his own choice.
Time will tell i just hope we can salvage some good performances & possibly a CC run.

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"The Golden Generation finally has its Golden Fleece! They have Wembley Cup Final winners medals to add to their collection." 23/08/2014:



Quote: RHINO-MARK "Not sure how early previous departures were decided prior to their oublic announcements tbh but its a fair point
Rumours and they are only rumours are that Mc.D will be moving on at the end of the season by his own choice.
Time will tell i just hope we can salvage some good performances & possibly a CC run.'"


I know if McDermott goes it most likely will be announced as a "mutual decision" and people will inevitably be dubious.....but you never know, he might genuinely think himself that he's gone as far as he can here.

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Quote: xparksider "IMO. True supporters offer support for the team through good and bad times. The team have given us all 10years of great times, not just good, and now times are not good. This is when [itrue[/i supporters stand by the team.

If a builders' house starts to fall to pieces because he looses 3 or 4 parts of it. Say, the supporting beams or props (let's call them Peacock and Leuluai), and the main power supply and power distribution system, (let's call them Sinfield and Aiton).
He starts to rebuild the house and installs a new power supply (McGuire) and uses second hand props and distribution system all imported from Australia.

He's looking forward to success in his re- build but knows it will take a long time before he has anything like the dream house he had a short while ago.

Then he hits another big problem, the new power supply breaks down after a very short time and then he looses most of his tools to do the job plus the remaining tools don't work as well as they used to.

This house will take a lot longer to re-build than anybody thought, even when all his best tools are found again.'"


Can't you just be self-satisfied with you super fandom? Is it really necessary start a smug, self-congratulatory thread on an internet forum? It makes you look like a sad b*****d. Pat yourself on the back fella if it means that much to you, but don't go fishing around the internet looking for others to do it for you

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