I am happy with him.

Defensive skills? I have always been of the opinion that defence is largely a matter of attitude. Skill plays a part but you cannot convince me that players have not received basic training in tackling and defensive reading of the game.

Lack of individual player development? Fans are deluding themselves in thinking this is entirely the head coach's responsibility. It surely rests on the will and attitude of individuals to improve themselves. The example of Jamie Peacock speaks volumes. Was he made a good player because of the training he received under Brian Noble? Of course not. Sinfield likewise was not coached into becoming a good leader. One only has to look at the number of promising players signed by Warrington who have not really progressed under Tony Smith (supposedly a good technical coach) - Myler, Atkins, maybe Daryl Clark...

It's a matter of perspective. Hardaker has improved in all aspects of the game from the skinny kid that debuted on the wing. I'd argue the same with Watkins, to the point where sometimes you wish he'd back his pure athletic ability a bit more. Similarly who gets credit for Mcguires development, or Peacocks game having so much more to it in the last 3 years or so?

Hall is a worry at the minute, as is the inability to unlock a defence from close range. But we've been like that the last couple of years.

I think it's a disservice to compare Macs Warrior ways to that of Wane. Mac focus on hard work and pushing yourself, rather than Wanes aggression first, blood and thunder model.

If you want to say the players were the reason we won everything then I suppose I can see where your coming from, but plenty of good teams have been held back by a coach. You only have to look at our own team in the last year of Bluey. Imo he might have been a bit lucky, but he was also the right man at the right time.

I've always assumed the substitution policy contributes to the warrior mentality and the big game wins? Surprises me this is such a mystery to many.

Never met the guy, but I suspect he's a complex and sometimes difficult individual, but then the best leaders often are...

This.

Most folk (me included) were filthy with the bloke for our insipid start to that season. However, he managed to turn it around and despite a wall of opposition took out the SL trophy and proved a LOT of people wrong. (again, me included)

When we started struggling again the next season, folk still couldn't accept he'd proved them wrong the season before and came unstuck yet again when we rallied and took out the SL title.

Fact is LeedsDave has it nailed. The guy has consistently proved people wrong, which in turn has wound up some of our fan base into an apoplectic rage at points. Face it after been proved wrong, time after time people are now going out of their way to find any excuse to have a pop at the guy.

He's not a bombastic coach, he doesn't really brag, yes he has been guilty of whinging at times but ATEOTD he has consistently brought us success, the people who really matter (the playing staff) trust him to do the right things so why cant we?

I think the comparison with Wane is useful - when Wigan's blood and thunder doesn't work there's nothing left, well unless you include a Tony Clubb high ball... McD's teams have character and finesse when it counts.

It is a matter of perspective - Hardaker would have experienced natural improvement as he grew physically and gained experience same for Watkins but the glaring shortfalls in both of their games haven't been addressed. Mcdermott works with these players every day.

McGuire I would agree on Peacock I saw no differences in his game under McDermott the same for Sinfield and can you honestly Burrow has developed any new skills under McDermott?

The warrior thing is different from Wane but the concept is the same - it is about being physically dominant which is important in a setting a platform but if you don't have the skills to capitalise it is all wasted.

But Hardakers passing, positional sense etc have improved and it is not all down to getting older. Same with Watkins, hew has some lovely passes in his locker and his defence has improved tenfold. Some of that must be down to coaching?

Peacocks game changed immensely, from an out and out battering ram to someone capable of being a link man, granted not on the level of FGB or Cuthbo but still it was another facet to his game. I won't argue with you on Burrow, his passing from DH is a bit better, but that could be just down to being asked to do it more.

I actually think Macs mentality is as much about being mentally tougher than your opponent. This is something JP talks about all the time, rather than just knocking 10 bells out of people as is the Wane way.

So far it's served us well.

thought this was going to be about the free travel to cas

Super League is the appropriate level of employment for a RL coach of his standard.

Cannot disagree with the last point

How does the saying go ' start listening to the fans and soon you will be sitting with them'.

I often don't agree with his team choice, his game plan or his interchange use.

However, I've never won anything and since he came out trophy cabinet needs a full-time cleaner.

He isn't here to be loved, he is here to keep the club winning. Hard to really knock him.

My point is though that not a lot has changed since his first season, obviously at the start of 2011 he looked absolutley hopeless and has proved himself better than that but a few problems still remain.
Given we have won 5 major trophies in his time here isnt it surprising that we have only finished in the top 4 twice?
I dont know if that means he has over achieved or under achieved tbh
Even last season, which some fans have called the best Leeds team ever, we still lost a lot of regular season games, and have yet to go through a season with him without at least one poor run of form
Compare that to the 2004 team under Tony Smith that absolutely blasted nearly everyone in the league finishing top by a record margin, with arguably a lesser team
To put this in perspective, Anderson and Wane have managed to finish in the top 4 every season, even though they have lesser squads and I would still call them lesser coaches

I dont think its as black and white as you make out, for me there are legitimate grievances to have with Mac, and I havnt seen many on here that seem to be blindly against him without reason...

I've been bewildered by McDermott on many occasions but he coached us to an amazing treble last season, so yes I'm happy with him. I don't particularly care if we have an off-year after that.

I spoke with Brian McDermott during a tricky period in 2011, and found it an uneasy conversation with him appearing to get quite defensive, much the same as his persona during media interviews around that time. Despite our success in his first 2 seasons I couldn't quantify what positive impact he'd had on the team, or if he'd just been in the right place, with the right players, at the right time. Five years down the line I've got used to his uneasy manner and the trophy cabinet is full. I like the way he commits himself 100% to the job, and obviously thinks deeply about what he does day in day out. Despite a tricky start to the season I think it would be wrong to question his judgement, he has credit in the bank. Whether he is a good coach can only ever be an opinion, there is never a factual formula to determine how good a coach is. There may be better coaches elsewhere with the "wrong" team that will never have chance to manage a big club like Leeds, but McDermott could also be the best coach realistically available. I've disagreed with his sub rotation and game tactics on many occasions, but I'm sure that could apply to any incumbent coach when things aren't working . I'm happy for him to carry on developing as a coach, that is an ongoing process and not just applicable to the players.

I think it should also be mentioned that imo at least, the standard of SL coaching is at an all time low, so its not like we could replace him with a guaranteed world beater
He clearly does some things well and can motivate players when we need it most, there are just some things I find really frustrating, and I dont understand how he hasnt figured out his mistakes, hes like bloody Arsen Wenger
The main one obviously being only using one sub in the first half (and sometimes not using a sub), it cost us last year against cas, and noone mentions it but he did it AGAIN in the WCC and we unsurprisingly got blitzed in the second half