So why should fans bother with the regular season games then?

Why do any fans go to any sport?

Fair point. But a lot of fans feel,rightly, short changed. Hetheringtons attitude may change if season ticket sales plummet

Just to get some more view on this, I don't really care so much about winning, I grew up watching Leeds teams get beaten frequently so it's nothing new and disappointing.

The thing I would like us to do is to perform to our potential, and we do that less and less frequently these days. The coach's job is to get the players to perform, and well he just hasn't done it enough for me. Seems a strange thing to say when we have made every final since he took charge, but it's wider than that for me, although I accept it's very simplistic for some others.

For me its a bit of both however I think the coach is more responsible some of his tactics have been shocking with regards use of subs or not as the case may be and the insistance of playing the same flogged players week in week out when we have sum undoubtedly talented youngsters at the club chomping at the bit for invaluable game time its baffling at times

And as i said on another thread today I dont think the players take much notice of the current coaching regime we were down to 2 subs after losing Kirke and Delaney and Hood was stood on the side line 3 times trying to get on and whoever he was to replace just refused to give way I personally seen Ablett refuse to come off when Chris Plume told him too as they were stood behind the sticks waitin for Brough to add another 2 points to the thirty odd they already had at that point so for me Mcdermotts at fault as I dont think he demands the respect needed to be Head Coach of any team

to leeds owl you forgot Wakie they even put 40 past us this season I know we beat them but only by 4 points and that was at HQ

Is it also fair to suggest they've only played to their fullish potential in three or four games in two years under McDermott?

The knock out stat is interesting in that a favoured draw might allow a run deep in a competition without achieving a tropy at the end of it and that's all that really matters.

McDermott's Leeds record against the better clubs is the major concern for me. These are the clubs that will be difficult to avoid for silverwear and the record is getting worse under this coach. V St Helens it's 1 from 5, V Wigan it's 1 + a draw from 6, V Warrington it's 2 from 6.

Even though Huddersfield aren't in that group it's now 2 from 5 for them as well and Catalans despite never winning a game at Headingley are breaking even from the four fixtures over the last two seasons.

Totally unexpected performances in last season's Qualifying Semi-Final, Grand Final and this year's Challenge Cup Semi-Final aside it's been a pretty ordinary looking squad making pretty ordinary looking performances for the most part of the last 69 fixtures.

Well, there's the question. What matters? The most part, or the key part?

None of our newer players have improved under McDermott's coaching. Griffin is not as good as he was at Hudds, Moore and Hauraki as they were at Crusaders, Lunt's got progressively worse since joining us. Only Hardaker has kicked on, and even he was going backwards in the position he was being coached to play.

That suggests the coaching team is the bigger problem.

I think its both tbh some players are a just getting older and less effective especially when they are getting flogged with little or no rotation and others just aren't good enough for a top team hoping to compete year in year out for every trophy on offer.
I admire the way the Coach handled the Senior and Webb situations and backed the youngsters yet he talks a 35yr old prop OUT of retirement and continues to hammer JP for 60 minutes or so a game irrespective of importance or score.
I also don't see why when we are losing game after game or certain players are playing poor for weeks at a time that they can't be dropped.
It's clear the team can't/wont get his coaching ideas on structure both attacking and defensively or they just don't trust them.
I think this team/squad should be better competitively on a more consistent basis but it isn't happening and i HOPE GH sticks to bis threat of a over-haul but also hope he includes his Coaching staff when doing his review because lest face it they ALL rightly get the praise when we are doing well so the same should be applied when we are aren't playing well.
Whatever the outcome of our play-off campaign i think there are issues to be sorted squad and coaching wise and i hope GH maintains his great record of keeping us competeting at the top.

Hetherington said after the embarrassing home capitulation to Wigan that it's not a coaching issue.

In the same article he also posed the question as to whether this squad had run it's course but he was careful not to answer it himself at the time. Hasn't he since said only Webb would be leaving?

Some overhaul that was.

Leuluai, Hauraki, McShane and Moore out. Achurch, Lunt, Taylor and Walmlsley in. Griffin & Taylor starting props, JP off the bench after 15 minutes with Bailey. JJB, Delaney & Clarkson to start in SR, with Achurch coming off the bench. Walmlsey & Kirke to force the competition, Ablett to move into the centres permanently with Keinhorst forcing the competition. Chisholm to get a chance on the right wing ahead of the powderpuff BJB.

Rhinos 2013:

1. Hardaker
2. Jones-Bishop
3. Watkins
4. Ablett
5. Hall
6. McGuire
7. Burrow
8. Taylor
9. Lunt
10. Peacock
11. Jones-Buchanan
12. Achurch
13. Sinfield
14. Ward
15. Delaney
16. Bailey
17. Kirke
18. Clarkson
19. Walmsley
20. Griffin

That was the "official" line at the time yes mate but i'm hoping we have a more meaningfull backlash ala when Daryl Powell had his big clear-out of the past it and not good enough.

When did we sign Lunt ,Taylor and Walmsley Tykes/Rhinos no1?
FWIW i'd take Taylor and Walmsley but would pick Mcshane over Lunt every day of the week.

would that be the same chisholm who is now a leeds carnegie player?