Explain to me how Huddersfield and Hull FC - who are tenants to SMCs - are going to be "light years ahead" of Leeds in the near future? If it wasn't for Ken Davy underwriting cheap season tickets the Giants would still be playing to a quarter full stadium in which they have absolutely zero capital interest.

As for the comments about Salford, Cas and Widnes "not being far behind".

The time to do that would have been when YCCC were sold on the idea of moving to Durkar.

Too much investment has gone into the complex since to make moving away commercially justifiable, and that's before you get into the issue of how you raise the funds to finance a brand new 20-25k capacity stadium.

Although I believe GH Knows what he is doing some recent activity questions that, I would like to see ground develop over time but not at the expense of the on field team, the bulls may never recover for years from having a poor team over the past few years not that I am bothered I just dont want us to spiral downwards in the same manner as a successful team has good support and any potential new stand needs to be full to help pay for it.

Get real Andy, 15 years - which figment of your imagination did that come from!!! all the fans are asking is that the club has a squad and facilities befitting the financial investment they have made. Given they are, after Wigan, the best supported club with the largest revenue streams it is not unreasonable. 4th to 7th is OK - it is true you do hanker after the days when following Leeds was a form of masochiam

I always assumed that the Headingley complex cost Caddick/Hetherington the £6 million debt accrued under the previous ownership. We certainly got to hear about the debt for several seasons thereafter as the first 'cheque' written each month was the one to service it.

Perhaps it's fair to call £6million (in 1997) a pittance for the complex but it's not a term I'd use in 2011 considering it's still a sporting venue rather than the site of a Hyper market or retail park.

Couldn't have really been timed much better this could it....

rlSuper League licensing summaries publishedrl

That is correct - debt was extinguished when the cricket ground was sold to YCCC for 11m?

Me too and there's little to add to what the posters from that camp have said in response to the knee jerkers whop are over reacting to on field issues and yesterday SOuth Stand press release.

The Club is turning over £10 million plus, has cash reserves, has contested one of the two major finals in every season since 2003 bar one and has just created the greatest ever legacy of championships in Super League's short history.

The South Stand Shennanigans and certain posters reactions to it remind me of the reactions to the Harris saga when GH lost the skirmish with the RFL allowing the Bulls to register him and was forced to apologise for saying the Bulls coerced Harris. Afterwards, similar questions were asked about GH and I'm certain posters like Bywater and Gotcha would have been full of their usual rhetoric. But, as someone earlier said, GH played the long game and we all know how that saga panned out.

I've no idea what the long game is with stadium developments but won't over react like some to yesterday's developments. I also know that Caddick and GH know a damn site more about the process than anyone questioning them on here.

You have to separate running the business from on-field performance and player recruitment. They are very different things.

Its ridiculous to question GH/Caddick on the business side given the fact we nearly went completely out of business when they took over. Hardly any sporting businesses anywhere in the world make a profit. Investing in them is usually a very bad idea. The fact that we as a club are profitable is far more remarkable than people seem to think.

On the recruitment front I'd say there's always been evidence that GH is a bit hit and miss. If you look back over his tenure there have been several 'Ben Cross' type signings. Again though, the overall record since GH took over has been very good, as evidenced by GFs we've won.

Regarding performances this year I'm still of the view that GH simply made the wrong choice of coach. I don't have a problem with that if he seeks to correct that at some stage (assuming no Lazarus-like resurrection of the team under BM).

It could also be said this is a club with the largest revenue streams with a trophy winning record - in SL era - worse than St Helens and Bradford. It could also be suggested from this position the club has under achieved?

Looking at the much vaunted cash position; has this been generated through operational excellence or sale of assets?

I have said this before - it is much easier to run a business when cash flow is not an issue. In the early days Caddick was bouyant and cash rich so GH didn't have to concern himself with that issue.

Finally the success of any sporting club is very tightly linked to on field performance - revenue streams can only be maintained if on field standards are maintained. It is no surprise crowds are falling at Leeds as the success on the field declines. This begs the question regarding recruitment of both players and coaches over the past two years?

The next set of financial data from the club will be the most interesting to date and should give a greater insight at how the various stakeholder groups are effecting strategy and profitability.

I do not think we're that far behind and considering Hetherington came in to a sinking ship after Super League had already begun he's done a good job playing catch up.

Turnover has nothing to do with asset sales these last few years.

I don't think Caddick has ever subsidised the Rhinos. I think they've been run as a stand alone operation.

I agree to an extent but not entirely. Unlike, say Bradford, whose early commercial successes were based around instant on field successes GH has built the business to a degree where it is not dependant upon on the field results and that is key because nobody can run a club and ensure they win the championship every single season. Of course, we'll be better off commercially if we're more successful but we won't be in the mess others are if we're not.

This I agree with. When are they published?

Gareth,

Cash isn't just about turnover - if you sell a player and receive a huge amount of money i.e Harris the money still shows on the balance sheet. The huge overdraft Caddick inherited wasn't reduced by operation profitability it was cleared when the cricket ground was sold. Also the cash position is a very transient position that can change quiet easily and quickly depending on operational issues. Whilst Leeds had 2m+ available cash at the time of the accounts I would be very surprised if that is the norm through the year. Most firms would maximise working capital at the Y/E

Caddick guaranteed the overdraft, it provided GH with the necessary working capital not to have to worry whether the players were going to get paid. It also stopped the bank calling in part or all of the overdraft.

I disagree regarding the correlation between on field success and profit, his dismay at the lack of ticket sales for the final and the lower than expected season ticket showed how important these issues are. Last year Leeds were still riding on the back of 3 GF wins in a row and 2010 being a blip. Now fans and sponsors have seen a further regression you can see this revenue stream going only one way.

Once upon a time a certain poster managed to lower expectations with a relentless series of negative impressions for the up-coming season/s.

It appears that poster (in that role) has now been replaced by the actions (or the lack of) at the summit of the club itself.

If anyone (based on the situation we see today) is still optimistic for the prospects (on and off the field) in 2012 I think I need a pint of what they're drinking and I'm tee-total.

There is still time from GH to announce the signing of Benji Marshall, SBW and Matt Scott - their up the sleeve waiting to be allowed out