Nice use of language, not showing any bias at all

Sutcliffe

Sinfield

My God you talk some guff. The obvious response to your ridiculous statement being, none of those players were positioned at half back.

It takes years to become a proficient creative half back, if it didn't Thurston would never have left the Bulldogs, Schofield would never have played centre (same for Laurie Daley) and Lockyer wouldn't have been a full back. Even recently in the SL, Brough bumped along through the bottom feeders for a number of years before finding his feet.

I'm not sure if Sutcliffe has what it takes right now but, I am certain that he is not the reason we are struggling so badly and we will not find out how far he can go by chucking him to the wolves now.

In the Saints game alone last season, he showed plenty of what he CAN do. He read the game well, ran well at second receiver, put in some good kicks and moved the ball around with some skill. With the exception of BJB, I never saw any of the players you are talking about, take the game by the scruff of the neck and win it (even for 40 minutes). Get off his back and give the guy a chance.

I could quite easily label the same statement at you. I am well aware half backs take time to settle, however they also show they have the ability in the first place to warrant that settling period, and that they could do it in future. I have said this many times, and still never seen a post to refute it, there is no difference between Sutcliffe and Lee Gaskell at the same ages, they are like for like players completely. Gaskell however, had many better games in the halfs, and was the choice of porn for certain sky commentators. Howver, what is his level now? what position is he? Saints knew what they were doing, and for the right reason. Are you suggesting Saints would regret their decision?

We have had two or three half backs over the last decade who looked miles better than Sutcliffe, they were sent packing. Do the club regret it? I can't recall seeing your posts of not to write them off.

Have Mcguire Sinfield Burrow etc never looked "lost" when the whole team has struggled for form in the past?
Indeed it took Sinfield plenty of time to settle in at 6 in fact he spent plenty of time just where Stevie Ward is now in the SR.
The fact yer writing the kid off after 7mths out after major surgery no pre-season & thrown into a rudderless team with 2 wins in 10 games really ?'s how you judge a player imo.

Did someone really use Simon Worrall there, what next Joe Vickery .....

I am not writing him off after 7 months of injury. I pointed out the problems with his game last season, before his injury, and that stand off was not the position for him. The injury is nothing more than an excuse for people to use. That would effect his speed, it wouldn't effect his limited skill level. Infact, as I repeat, go back to my appraisal of Saturdays game and you will see my praise of him in the centre role. Is that writing off? Do you really think he has shown anything close to the level Gaskell showed at Saints?

Gaskell at St Helens is one example but so is Kevin Brown at Wigan - all depends on your point of view.

McGuire at 7 and 1st receiver with Sutcliffe at 6 is Leeds' most likely looking combination when available. If McGuire continues to be unavailable for chunks of the season then going forward the number one priority is to find a quality number 7 - Burrow nor no pace Lilley need apply. Sutcliffe is no Sinfield at the moment but he has the potential to be a good player with a bit of patience, good coaching and support around him on the field, IMO.

Whatever happened to Simon Worrall?

7mths injured isnt an excuse at all its a fact during which 99.9% will be purely re-hab with a view to completing at least part of a pre-season which never happened.
Also how much gametime has he had in the current set up with Mags at 7 Falloon at 9 & with a team around him actually functioning?
Re-Gaskell how long did ST's give him before pulling the trigger & when they did if he's that good how come he's at Bradford?
Its been far too easy for some to rip a young HB apart when our problems are blatantly bigger elsewhere id also add its interesting you jump to Hardakers defencd re-Coaches orders when i also know Sutty/Delaney were both told to run it as much as poss last year so how do you know he hasnt been told the same again?
Yes he's struggled at times but that doesn't automatically prove he isnt capable of playing as a 6 EVERY player goes through those phases & looking at he bigger picture its no surprise he's struggled.

Went back to RU iirc.

Completely agree re-Sutty but i also think there's plenty if potential with Lilley.

No I did not say this. However after a fantastic start to the season with the whole team in good form (in which Sutty figured at 6 when Sinny was injured) we then lost our way a bit without a win in 3 games while Sutty was at 6. Sinfield then replaced him and we got back to winning ways again. The reason I make this point is to challenge your suggestion and inference that Sutty deserved to keep the 6 spot and his good form was keeping Sinfield out and only injury prevented him remaining there which was not the case.




I have never said Sutty hasn't played well. He has been a valued utility player over quite some time. The issue is whether he is a natural 6.



We are all only expressing opinions. Mine have been consistent over time and not based just on recent events. Because I sometimes offer a different opinion to the pack doesn't make me wrong either.



I am not challenging Sutcliffe's place in the squad - just his position. Without a replacement for the Sinfield role our squad is unbalanced and we lack adequate cover in the halves when McGuire is unavailable as events have proven. This was predicted by some. If we had players capable of playing the pivot role at 13 or FB then it would be ok to play just a runner at 6. But IMO we need at least 2 creative pivots in the side.

MS - From what I've seen (which I admit is not a great deal) Lilley appears to be a slower, non- tackling version of Paul McShane. I could only see him in the hooking role at Leeds but he'd have to improve his defence first, as ever just my opinion.

According to Wiki Simon Worrall continued to play League in the domestic French comp.